Is it worth it to refurbish mouthpieces? + How do you buy mouthpieces if you are a school band director?

[sirisobhakya]

My former school band will have new members soon (grade 6 students), and yesterday I helped my former band director and underclassmen test and sort the “vacant” horns. Trombone does quite well: 10 out of 12 vacant horns are above 70% playability, comparing to horn’s 0% (all six vacant horns broke down and can’t be played).

The problem lies with the mouthpieces. Although all horns have their mouthpiece in their case, some lost their plating but still smooth, but around half have badly pitted rim, and I mean badly: you cannot play without some degree of pain or irritation. Not just trombone, but tuba as well.

The situation is more severe in small shank horns; large shanks horn have plenty of Yamaha 48 from marching baritones lying around. Unfortunately, the small shank horn is what the newcomers have to use. And I don’t want them to have bad impression of trombone from the bad mpcs.

That leads to my first question: is it worth it (against buying new mpcs) to have the mpcs refurbished and replated? I asked one repair shop and they said they may have to grind the rim down or even “cut” it, which should have some effect to the intonation, or does it?

The second question: if you are (I am sure some actually are) school band director, which size or range of size of mpcs would you choose to buy for the students (grade 6-12)? I know the good start point should be around Bach 6 1/2 AL or Yamaha 48, and some use it for all of their lives, but I also believe that each player is different and it is always good to have choices lying around to match them.

[BGuttman]

Pitted mouthpiece, especially very common ones, are not worth trying to fix. For the same money you can buy a new mouthpiece.

I would look into the Faxx line. I'm sure you can find a dealer somewhere in Asia who will ship to Thailand. Or there may be a Chinese manfacturer who has decent quality copies of US mouthpiece designs.

For sizes, kids the age of your band kids generally don't know enough to know they need a bigger (or smaller) mouthpiece. When I was in Grade 6 (age 10 or so) we all played 12C trombone mouthpieces. Tuba played a real small tuba mouthpiece (30?) and trumpets generally played a 7C. Remember, these kids are still going to grow and thus smaller mouthpieces for now.

[keybone]

Yes on Faxx good, solid mouthpieces for $35/40 each.

In the late ‘70’s, I took a middle school band director position in an urban area where everybody played a school instrument. None of the brass instruments had a mouthpiece, not one to be seen! My band budget for the year was $25 (not a misprint!). I went to the local music store nine blocks from the school, told them my story. They gave me a box of about 20 used mouthpieces and told me to keep the $25. Saved my tail!

Needless to say, I spent a lot of money at that store for the rest of my teaching career (35 years)!

[Geordie]

I’ve only had one mouthpiece (not pitted) replated and it was as good as new. No regrets.

[ghmerrill]

Bruce is right that it's hard to Beat Faxx in terms of quality/cost. The only problem with Faxx is it doesn't have a very broad selection, but for early students, this isn't a problem. Kelly is also a real alternative for students as well, and in the same price range. And the Kelly pieces are almost indestructable and won't dent.

Both have a clone of the Bach 25 for tuba, and I would STRONGLY recommend this as a tuba mouthpiece for a beginning/intermediate student. NOT the dreadful (yet bizarrely popular) 24AW!

Why pay money to replate an already worn piece when you can get a new (and good quality) one for the same cost (or often less)? Certainly this seems to be the case for the student players you're considering.

[Matt K]

Yeah you can't have them re-plated for less than the price of a Faxx. And if you can... you probably shouldn't because they're probably skimping on the material. I'd probably get a few of the sizes but mostly stick with the 6.5AL.

2nd on the kelly's actually as well. They aren't as sturdy as metal ones in my direct experience... though they are pretty sturdy. They do come with a lifetime warranty. You're supposed to ship them back and pay for shipping but you might be able to work something out with them isnce that would be absolutely cost prohibitive if you were to take them up on that being in a different country.

[ghmerrill]

There are trade-offs. You can drop a Kelly on a slate floor and it bounces about a foot or so (trust me), while dropping a brass mouthpiece on the same floor results in a much shorter set of bounces and a deformed shank end. So you should definitely also get one of those shank repair tools with your brass mouthpieces.

On the other hand, I suppose you could more easily chip a Kelly in certain circumstances, or melt it with some careless torch work. But overall, I give the Kelly an edge in general durability, though perhaps not longevity.

[doctortrombone]

There are quite a few Chinese 12c and 6 1/2AL mouthpieces on Ebay or Amazon for less than $10 shipped. I've bought a few out of curiosity and found them to work OK in general. A few were nickel plated and caused skin irritation. The others seemed to have a high quality silver plating on them. Plus, how can you say no to something with a name like TOOGOO or Aibay? Isn't Aibay what they call Ebay in Australia?

[sirisobhakya]

Thank you everyone, and special thanks to Bruce. I have never considered Faxx mouthpiece before; I thought it is more expensive than Yamaha...

WWBW ships to Thailand, apparently free of shipping charge. And the price seems highly attractive. I shall talk with the band director again tomorrow. Maybe 2 6.5s and 2 7Cs, if he is willing to spend.

[ghmerrill]

There are quite a few Chinese 12c and 6 1/2AL mouthpieces on Ebay or Amazon for less than $10 shipped. I've bought a few out of curiosity and found them to work OK in general.

The otherwise unmarked 1.5G mouthpiece I got with my Schiller bass trombone turned out to be one of the best 1.5G mouthpieces I tried. Unfortunately, before I realized this, I'd given it away! -- but to a high school band, so I still felt good about it.

[BrassedOn]

If raw brass is exposed on the rim, there is chance for irritation or worse. Ditch them.

If budget is an issue, see if you can find a way to tap into local player teacher community. know I have at least one good piece I could donate local if asked. That never suited me but came with a horn purchase. I’d expect similar where you live.

Of course individuals should have their own piece and not share even with school equipment. Things like cold sores are with you for life if you catch the virus.

[sirisobhakya]

Of course individuals should have their own piece and not share even with school equipment. Things like cold sores are with you for life if you catch the virus.

In my country, even a mouthpiece is quite an expensive luxury considering the salary base. I make $1000 a month, comparing to around $2300 a month I made when I worked in Japan. The cost of living is different, yes, but the mouthpiece price is the same. Worse, some parents still think that music is a nonsense distraction from studying. So one cannot expect parents to buy their kid a personal mouthpiece. (My parents also were, or maybe even are, like that. But I am working on my own now so they can say whatever they want and I would still play.)

I would like to donate equipments though. I already donated two used horns and two (large shank) mouthpieces I bought when I was in Japan. But now as my financial situation is quite tight (my last salary and tax refund is still in Japan) and I came home with almost no money at all (since there is backtax and the refund took a long time to be paid), maybe I have to wait until next semester to buy 1-2 mouthpieces for them.

[BGuttman]

Suggestion if you have to use the bad mouthpieces for a while:

Put a layer of nail polish on the rim. It will be a barrier between lips and raw brass and can even smooth out some of the pitting.

You will have to recoat periodically since the nail polish isn't very resistant to abrasion.

Not a long term solution, though.

[Ted]

Or try the Arnolds & sons, they're cheap and OK. On thomann.de.

[Doug Elliott]

A brand name mouthpiece with a messed-up rim is a good candidate for threading. I will accept donations of such mouthpieces and when I have time I can thread and replate them, to use with my rims.

And I can straighten the end of the shank if it's not round.

It costs me time and money to do that and I would offer them for sale, but I could also donate some to a worthy school that needs mouthpieces. I have plenty of used rims that are in decent shape.