TromboneChat

OK, so I am a high school trombone player and I recently bought a Bach 42 BO. It came with a 6 1/2 AL mouthpiece, and the salesman said I could get a new mouthpiece for free if I didn't want that one. Meanwhile, my private teacher loaned me one of his old mouthpieces it is a Yamaha 57, it's an old model they don't make anymore (or so I was told). Anyway,I was wondering if I could get some reccomendations for a mouthpiece, I dabble in some Bass tromboning in my jazz band, and I don't want to lose my low range with a 6 1/2 AL, that's why I have the Yamaha because it's a little bigger. Can i get a few reccommendations for a new mouthpiece?

Quote from: wichman9 on Jun 25, 2007, 11:18AMOK, so I am a high school trombone player and I recently bought a Bach 42 BO. It came with a 6 1/2 AL mouthpiece, and the salesman said I could get a new mouthpiece for free if I didn't want that one. Meanwhile, my private teacher loaned me one of his old mouthpieces it is a Yamaha 57, it's an old model they don't make anymore (or so I was told). Anyway,I was wondering if I could get some reccomendations for a mouthpiece, I dabble in some Bass tromboning in my jazz band, and I don't want to lose my low range with a 6 1/2 AL, that's why I have the Yamaha because it's a little bigger. Can i get a few reccommendations for a new mouthpiece?

I also have a Yamaha 57, which I don't use much anymore.  It's about the size of a Bach 3G; maybe more toward a 2G.  The 2G is a "small bass" or "transition" mouthpiece for players who want to do both kinds of parts on one mouthpiece.

Btw, I'm going to move this to Mouthpieces, where you will get more suggestions.  Fasten seat belts...

Quote from: wichman9 on Jun 25, 2007, 11:18AMOK, so I am a high school trombone player and I recently bought a Bach 42 BO. It came with a 6 1/2 AL mouthpiece, and the salesman said I could get a new mouthpiece for free if I didn't want that one. Meanwhile, my private teacher loaned me one of his old mouthpieces it is a Yamaha 57, it's an old model they don't make anymore (or so I was told). Anyway,I was wondering if I could get some reccomendations for a mouthpiece, I dabble in some Bass tromboning in my jazz band, and I don't want to lose my low range with a 6 1/2 AL, that's why I have the Yamaha because it's a little bigger. Can i get a few reccommendations for a new mouthpiece?

Ask Doug Elliott.
He is around and KNOWS !!!!!!!!!!!

in my opinion the 57 is a small bass mouthpiece, NOT a tenor mouthpiece, i used a 58 on my bass for a while for smaller bass work before moving to my 1. 6 1/2 are your stock mouthpiece and are generally not that great, even guys who like something similar usually fairly quickly got to 6 1/4 or 6 3/4. If you want to keep your low chops (and I'm not saying you can't have low chops on a 6.5, it is mostly your own strength) i'd recomend about a 4 or 5g. The 4 can be a bit of work in high school but if you can control it sounds great.

The 57 is indeed not made anymore. The Schilke 57 is, you may want to try one of those. At least in Schilke's specs, the 57 is only about .3mm smaller than a Yamaha 58, which is still made.

If anything, unless you plan to move into more full-time bass tromboning, I'd go just a tad smaller, like a Yamaha 56. Only about .25-.3mm smaller than a 57. In Bach sizes, in between a 2G and 3G, maybe closer to the 3G. If you mostly play bass, and are looking for a mpce. for doubling on tenor, that size range will probably be OK. The conventional wisdom for sizes on large tenors usually puts players on a size between 50 and 53, in Schilke/Yamaha numbers, Bach 5G to 3G.

Without knowledge of you, your playing, or where you're coming from, no one can give you valid advice.

But I'm going to suggest staying with what you have and using both, the 6-1/2 for tenor and the 57 for bass.  That will give you some perspective to base future opinions on.

I like the 6.5 and 57/whatever combo. That will give you a different enough sound to warrant changing mouthpieces. I wouldn't go for anything like a 3G or smaller, as I don't think it will give you enough difference. Unless you want to play a 3G for everything that is.


You might like the FAXX 1.5G, especially if the 57 is a (discontinued) loaner.



Congratulations on the new horn!
Every now and then I really think about going to a 42B with a 6.5 and a 1.5G; I think it's a GREAT combo.

used  6 1/2 s  are easy to find 
 so  i would  trade it for   a  new   mpc    5g  5gb   --
 you  will still hhave low  range  even w  the 6 1/2 
one size  doesnt  fit  all  // players facial structure  differ
-----
sometimesit  takes  years      to find  an optimun   fit [or direction]
 of  maybe  playing  next to  doug  on  a  tour  !!!!!!!!!
------------
  shilke 57  is  towards the  large   size  for  a  42b --
however  6 1/2  have been  and continue to be   used  w  42b  by   some  players --
=========
adjust your   ears   to  the sounds  of  bass   and   large tenor 
have  a  sound  concept  !!!!!!!!
==========
stick  a 1 1/2  g in the 42  -ITS STILL NOT  GONNA BLOW LIKE  A BASS BONE
===========
dont  be  a  DABBLER  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!  BE  A DOUBLER
========
your  low range  depends on  flexibility 
=======
just  like  high  range 
the magic is in the  player






Quote from: wichman9 on Jun 25, 2007, 11:18AMOK, so I am a high school trombone player and I recently bought a Bach 42 BO. It came with a 6 1/2 AL mouthpiece, and the salesman said I could get a new mouthpiece for free if I didn't want that one. Meanwhile, my private teacher loaned me one of his old mouthpieces it is a Yamaha 57, it's an old model they don't make anymore (or so I was told). Anyway,I was wondering if I could get some reccomendations for a mouthpiece, I dabble in some Bass tromboning in my jazz band, and I don't want to lose my low range with a 6 1/2 AL, that's why I have the Yamaha because it's a little bigger. Can i get a few reccommendations for a new mouthpiece?

Quote from: dj kennedy on Jun 30, 2007, 06:47AM
===========
dont  be  a  DABBLER  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!  BE  A DOUBLER
========

Now that's a great line!!

Andrew (who is making the transition between the two...)

I'm just a dabbler, so use thine grain of salt.

For Bass Trombone I'm happy with a Schilke 59, although my G&W Don Harwood doesn't break up as easily at the higher volume levels like the 59 does. 

The Bach 42 is more of a large bore tenor than a Bass.  I tend to favor a Bach 5GS on the tenor side.  You might want something slightly bigger for a 42, especially if you're gonna be playing Bass Trombone parts.  Maybe a Bach 1.5G, 2G, 3G, or 4G.  It seems like the Yamaha 57 is well suited(maybe on the big side) for the horn and its intended use.  Give it a couple weeks and see how you feel about it then.  You should be able to guess if you want to go bigger or smaller at that point.

For me adjusting to a larger mouthpiece takes longer than adjusting to a smaller one.  So don't dismiss a piece based on first impressions.  Give it a couple weeks, or a month and then compare it to what you're used to.  But at first glance a 6 1/2AL is most likely too small for the horn and it's intended use.  Not that you can't do everything you need to on a 6 1/2, but you might find it easier on something with a little more room.

The 6.5AL size pieces (Yamaha/Schilke 50, Wick 6BL etc) are good all around tenor mouthpieces, especially for students.  The 57/2G or 58/1.5G sizes are great for bass trombone, especially students and doublers.  I played a 6.5 and 1.5G as I was learning large tenor and bass and after years of playing larger size mouthpieces I'm finding myself moving back toward those sizes... going back to my roots or just returning to where I should have been all along

Remington anyone?

Quote from: Paisios on Nov 23, 2007, 07:35AMRemington anyone?

The Remington is not made any more although there seem to be an awful lot of them on Ebay.  They usually came on a special shank to fit the Elkhart Conn 8/88H (although I have one with a small shank).  The first "good" mouthpiece I got (from my 2nd teacher, who studied with Remington) was a Remington small shank.

You can get very similar results from a 5G-sized mouthpiece.

Well that shows you how out of touch I am! When did they stop making this mouthpiece? I use a Remington....my old teacher, Fred Marzan, had me get one the same time I got my 88H. Apparently I was taught trombone the same way Remington did. Marzan was a student of Bill Bell. So he passed on some great knowledge. He claimed it was the last mouthpiece I'd buy....he was right. I would recommend grabbing up a Remington if possible. But, I am biased and have used this mouthpiece exclusively for 16 years.

Please don't get me wrong, Paisios, I played a Remington for quite a while until I decided I needed something a little bigger and moved to the 4 rim (first a 4C, then a 4G when I got a large bore trombone, and now a Wick 4BS).  I keep my Remington in the case with the "emergency trombone" in my trunk and use it from time to time.

Conn probably stopped offering the Remington when Chief died.  At one time there was a Marcellus (I believe it was from Benge, but they were all under one roof then).  One Conn I got came with something called "Artist", which sure felt like a Remington.

There is probably a set of Elliott parts you can buy that would come close to a Remington, but Doug would probably have to tell us which.

Unfortunately "endorsed" mouthpieces don't go on forever, and often fall victim to changing tastes.  You don't see a Bell tuba mouthpiece anymore, nor a Pryor trombone (it's quite small by today's standards).  While we revere Remington for his teaching legacy and the huge number of his students now teaching, today's preeminent educators and players are flogging their own mouthpieces and methods.  Look at the Christian Lindberg and Joe Alessi series of mouthpieces.

Good points. Perhaps it is worthwhile to look into trying a new mouthpiece. Any recommendations for a remington user...I guess a second look at your post is in order!

Is there anything wrong with your current Remington?

If your Conn trombone has the old shank style, you can't use most of the newer mouthpieces on it.

Doug Elliott offers a special "Remington" shank and backbore but you have to ask for it.

The older Schilke mouthpieces used to have a shank that somehow managed to fit both the Conn taper and the Bach taper.  For you a 51D might be just the ticket (Remington mouthpieces have fairly deep cups).

Okay, I know I'm gonna get shot at when saying this, but for doubling on my Bach 42BO or Blessing B88, I just use my Christian Lindberg 5CL, great high register, and nice low. A lot of people around here don't like them, but the only other mouthpiece I've played on that feels as comfortable would be a Griego and I haven't been able to compare them(humm,,$55.00 Vs. $170.00), plus when I played on it I was still drooling over the Edwards it was in.LOL

It's not the right mouthpiece for a lot of people, but if it fits you like it fits me, then it's a match made in heaven. I'd recommend just getting a silver plated one for doubling, I have a hard time in my pedal range because it's so slippery, I can play the notes if they're like quARTER OR LARGER, BUT UNLESS I WIPE my mouthpiece off, they're hard to set up for. And if you don't like, people say they make a beautiful paperweight.

Being a Remington user (came with the Conn 88H back in 1966, that's what I used until Doug Elliott fixed me up recently with a set of cups and rim (see my profile) to fit the "R" leadpipe on the new Gen II 88H's. I also play a Conn 36H, 62H, and a MW 450S euphonium on a fairly frequent basis . Unfortunately, Doug is "in between" right now as a mouthpiece maker .

There is a Morse taper Bach that will be more congenial with your instrument. The 5GS, 5GB, Wick 5BL and 4BL with the large shank will more than likely suit your needs. IMHO, a 3G or equivalent is bordering on way too big for a large bore tenor trombone. Folks play 'em, though.

The Remington was such a beautiful match for the 88H's back in its day, and they sorta fit the "R" leadpipe on the new 88H's. 

I am fortunate to have my DE set-up ....perhaps he will be nudged back into business before too long . In the meantime, watch the TTF classified for something desireable for your use .

Probably not much help, though.

Thanks for all the info. I was more curious than anything. I will stick with the remington for sure. It's been good to me....and still is today!

Quote from: Doug Elliott on Jun 26, 2007, 09:16AMWithout knowledge of you, your playing, or where you're coming from, no one can give you valid advice.

But I'm going to suggest staying with what you have and using both, the 6-1/2 for tenor and the 57 for bass.  That will give you some perspective to base future opinions on.

I was going to post something about the 6 1/2AL when I saw this post, so I was then going to say this is pretty wise.  Then I saw it was from Doug and now I'm going to say "he knows what he's talking about"!   

Seriously, the 6 1/2AL is a "standard mouthpiece" for a reason.  Perhaps 40 years ago, we all used the 6 1/2 in the 88H, and it was a great sound, blending in with the music of the time, and sounding like a TROMBONE.  Today, everybody seems to want to sound bigger, louder, darker, and sometimes you get a trombone choir that sounds like a swimming pool full of molasses!

In the end, you have to find something that YOU like, that gives a sound that the others in your musical group like.  It can be a difficult balance to find.

The 57?  If you're just going to experiment with Bass Trombone, then it's probably OK.  If you get to the point where you're playing exclusively on Bass, then you will probably want to experiment more with mouthpieces.  Just remember, though, the same thing applies -- YOU have to like it, and others in your group (especially the director) have to like the sound you get on it.

Quote from: dj kennedy on Jun 30, 2007, 06:47AM===========
dont  be  a  DABBLER  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!  BE  A DOUBLER
========

By the way, DJ, do you mind if I add this great line to my sig file?

Strictly speaking from experience (which I can't say I have much of), a Schilke 51D suited me wonderfully.

Before my high school got a bass trombone, I played the bass parts on my Bach 42 with a Schilke 51D.  For the Ellington stuff we played (written for 3 trombones, neglecting the beautiful bass trombone), I had all the upper register I needed as well.  As far as an all purpose mouthpiece, a 51D, or even the bach 5G (which you could trade to get, yes?) should treat you well.

The deep cup on the Schilke might be a little much, but it's worth the work and can definitely sing in all registers.

The first 42 I got my hands on came with a 6-1/2A.  I believe it has the same rim and cup as the AL, but the throat and backbore are bigger.  I found it to be a nice starting point with the 42.  You might be able to find one used.  If mine hadn't disappeared into a black hole somewhere, I'd send it to you try.  Doug's advice is probably the best, however.

Just wondering if anyone can tell me if a Doug Elliott LT and XT series has interchangeable parts? I assume no, but just wanted to double check. ie. Can one rim fit both? What's the major diff in the size 8 and 9 shank?

The LT and XT mouthpieces use different cup and rim blanks, and I would not expect them to be interchangeable.  Maybe Doug can clear things up better.

The 8 and 9 backbores are different.  Actually, there are 3 large shank backbores; 7, 8, and 9.  The tightest is the 7, and the most open is the 9.  Most people seem to like the 8, which is a nice compromise.  I tried all 3 on my bass setup and for a while I played the 9 but as my percentage of bass trombone playing got smaller I moved to the 8.  Probably should have been there to start.

Earl Needham wrote:

"Today, everybody seems to want to sound bigger, louder, darker, and sometimes you get a trombone choir that sounds like a swimming pool full of molasses!"

Earl, you said it...... my thoughts exactly. I believe the 'huge' tenor mouthpiece is also part of the problem....... trying to use a particular size of piece just because some advertisement says so and so uses this mega-mouthpiece with all of its 'mega-variations'.

This just hurts students in the long run...... they never get to develop a sound with any 'life' to it...... because they don't use something that might actually fit their own facial and body structure.

If someone wants to sound like a cross between a bass trombone and a euphonium on a tenor trombone, then buy a bass trombone or a euphonium.

Quote from: BGuttman on Nov 24, 2007, 06:03AMPlease don't get me wrong, Paisios, I played a Remington for quite a while until I decided I needed something a little bigger and moved to the 4 rim (first a 4C, then a 4G when I got a large bore trombone, and now a Wick 4BS).  I keep my Remington in the case with the "emergency trombone" in my trunk and use it from time to time.

Conn probably stopped offering the Remington when Chief died.  At one time there was a Marcellus (I believe it was from Benge, but they were all under one roof then).  One Conn I got came with something called "Artist", which sure felt like a Remington.

There is probably a set of Elliott parts you can buy that would come close to a Remington, but Doug would probably have to tell us which.

Unfortunately "endorsed" mouthpieces don't go on forever, and often fall victim to changing tastes.  You don't see a Bell tuba mouthpiece anymore, nor a Pryor trombone (it's quite small by today's standards).  While we revere Remington for his teaching legacy and the huge number of his students now teaching, today's preeminent educators and players are flogging their own mouthpieces and methods.  Look at the Christian Lindberg and Joe Alessi series of mouthpieces.


I'm pretty sure the Marcellus is still around.  One thing I've notices about it is that it has a very shallow cup and a nice open backbore.  This is from comparing it to a Bach 6.5AL.  I play both and love the Marcellus way more.

I play on a Greg Black 5G, and I really like it.

I played a 6.5 in varying configurations for 14 years: bach, bach with gold, the 6.5 A, the Megatone, and you can do just about anything on that mouthpiece. 

I've noticed my needs have changed lately so i am trying a bunch of different stuff.  A monette (which i like, but only a couple of things are easier on that pice, maybe not enough to justify the bread unless...) and a bunch of 5-ish pieces to try ...

those ferguson pieces are GREAT!.

but i wouldn't even know what the heck i was looking for has i not played on the same 'piece for 14 years.  now i have a pretty good idea of what I can and can't do easily on that piece.

get to know what you can do on the 6.5 (there's a reason everyone uses one - or did, anyway...) and save the mouthpiece shuffle for when your chops are pretty solid.  When consistency becomes the rule instead of the exception....

just my 2 farthings...

Z

I change ricently my mouphpiece from 6,1/2 to 5G. It is more universal.

Quote from: Alexander on Jul 10, 2008, 03:18PMI change ricently my mouphpiece from 6,1/2 to 5G. It is more universal.

I think that's a rather odd statement.

While the 5G is often provided with new instruments (it used to be a 6 1/2 AL), it is not a "universal" mouthpiece.  If you are getting good results with a 6 1/2 AL, 12C, 22D, or 1G then that is good.  Changing a mouthpiece because you have a problem is reasonable.  Changing it because everybody else uses one (or because [insert trombone God here] uses one) is not a valid reason.  We are all different.  I wouldn't tell you to use the same mouthpiece I do unless you happened to be a clone of me.

Again, if you find a 5G is a better sounding mouthpiece (and they are popular for a reason) that's great.

Did you find the 5G to play better for you?

First post for me.  I've played the 6.5AL for over 30 years on all my horns and in my opinion it comes down to what fits your face. Quite a few years ago I did some experimenting with a few smaller cups/rims and nothing felt as comfy as the 6.5.  I have no idea how people can play a 12C... just does not feel right for me.

I recently "dabbled" with a few mouth pieces:  Curry 11s, Yamaha 48, and DW7cs.  The curry is a powerfull shallow mouth piece larger than the 12C. The Yamaha's very nice slightly smaller than the 6.5AL but deep. And the Denis Wick 7cs.  I ended up choosing the Denis Wick because it has the same rim or very close to the 6.5AL.  It is shallower and man do I like it. Very clear up to xF and as mentioned in a previous post, the sound is a bit brighter but I guess I don't care anymore!  My point is: go with what feels good and practice your rearend off.

I speak here as a person with little to no large tenor experience (it's my next instrument purchase- I swear!).
I spent the last week playing my friend's Shires tenor (1YM bell, TB47 slide, red tuning slide, Thayer) with my collection of 5-rimmed tenor pieces (Yamaha Canadian Brass, FAXX 5G, Denis Wick 5BL, Griego 4.5) and her two pieces (Greg Black 5G, Giddings & Webster Euros).
I realized a couple things from this endeavor. 1- I really like Shires. 2. I still don't like Thayers.
After playing Rochuts for hours (some by myself, some with my friend), warming up with different pieces, playing in large rooms, etc. I decided that the best pieces were- G@W Euros, followed by the FAXX and Greg Black 5Gs in a tie. Of course, with my luck, I have a Josef Klier 5BL coming, but didn't come in time to play with a good horn.
Just some of my (not very useful) thoughts on 5-rimmed tenor pieces.

I think Doug Elliott said it best.

My 42B came with a 6 1/2A in 1974. The A is the large shank version of the AL.  The "standard" that everyone at that time was either a Bach 5G or a Schilke 51. Some people went to the 51D. I still know a lot of people playing these. The 51 gives me a decent low register such that I can play bass if I have to, although a real bass trombone is always more fun to play and is a better sound to me.

I use a 6 1/2 AL as my small bore tenor mouthpiece. Until this thread, I didn't know anybody who played a 6 1/2 A(L) in a 42B. You'll figure it out.

This might lead to an off-topic discussion, but the 42B / 51 (or equivalent) is versatile enough that some players claim they can do everything on one horn. I disagree.

Cheers,
Martin

Quote from: Torobone on Sep 15, 2009, 09:28AMMy 42B came with a 6 1/2A in 1974. The A is the large shank version of the AL. 
Cheers,
Martin



That isn't exactly true as both the 6.5A and 6.5AL are available in large shank.  I know this because I have one of each.  The designations seem to have more to do with the backbore and throat sizes.

Quote from: Dan Hine on Sep 16, 2009, 03:43PMThat isn't exactly true as both the 6.5A and 6.5AL are available in large shank.  I know this because I have one of each.  The designations seem to have more to do with the backbore and throat sizes.

The only difference between my 6 1/2 A and 6 1/2 AL is the former has a large shank, and the latter has a small shank. If things have change in 35 years, I can accept that. The rim, backbore etc seem to be the same to me. My mouthpieces are as I describe them.

Quote from: Torobone on Sep 16, 2009, 04:49PMThe only difference between my 6 1/2 A and 6 1/2 AL is the former has a large shank, and the latter has a small shank. If things have change in 35 years, I can accept that. The rim, backbore etc seem to be the same to me. My mouthpieces are as I describe them.

Sorry, but Dan is right. The 6 1/2A and 6 1/2AL is available in BOTH large and small shank, and have been since at least the early 1970s, if not earlier.

The difference has ALWAYS been in the throat and the backbore. According to the Bach catalog, the 6 1/2AL has "The same rim and cup as No. 61⁄2A, but with a larger 'G' deep well rounded. throat and #420 backbore."

Quote from: fsung on Sep 16, 2009, 07:23PMSorry, but Dan is right. The 6 1/2A and 6 1/2AL is available in BOTH large and small shank, and have been since at least the early 1970s, if not earlier.

The difference has ALWAYS been in the throat and the backbore. According to the Bach catalog, the 6 1/2AL has "The same rim and cup as No. 61⁄2A, but with a larger 'G' deep well rounded. throat and #420 backbore."

I play my 6 1/2 AL daily, and when I travel I take my 6 1/2 A in my BerP (large shank). I've been playing the AL for 34 years, I've had the A for 35 years, and using the BerP off and on for about 20 years. I have never noticed a difference, and I was told there is no other difference than the shank. I wouldn't play the A in a horn, because I have a Schilke 51 for my 42B I've always found more appropriate, going back to the days when supplied mouthpieces were never that good to use.

Of course, that is only my personal experience. Maybe you own both like me, and have measured them more accurately than I can with the old quarter I drop into them, and have noticed something I haven't. Of course, I can't play them side by side, because they don't fit the same horn. The experience on my face is the same, based on the same rim size. For buzzing, the A is fine.

The catalog must be right. I stand corrected, and I'll add that to my book of semi-useless information.

Thanks,
Martin

Quote from: Torobone on Sep 16, 2009, 08:24PMOf course, that is only my personal experience. Maybe you own both like me, and have measured them more accurately than I can with the old quarter I drop into them, and have noticed something I haven't.

A digital caliper that can measure in .001 mm increments with ±.0005 mm accuracy can be bought for less than $40. which is a helluva lot more accurate than eyeballing how far a quarter fits in the mpc cup.

Nobody cares HOW long or how often you've been playing your mpcs, how you use them, or whether or not YOU notice a difference. Bottom line: if your "facts" are wrong, they're wrong, and need to be corrected.

And, while we're at it, it's bErp, Buzz Extension and Resistance Piece, not bUrp.

Quote from: mclaugh on Sep 17, 2009, 11:55AMA digital caliper that can measure in .001 mm increments with ±.0005 mm accuracy can be bought for less than $40. which is a helluva lot more accurate than eyeballing how far a quarter fits in the mpc cup.

Nobody cares HOW long or how often you've been playing your mpcs, how you use them, or whether or not YOU notice a difference. Bottom line: if your "facts" are wrong, they're wrong, and need to be corrected.

And, while we're at it, it's bErp, Buzz Extension and Resistance Piece, not bUrp.

My first flame! Thanks for that. I'll correct my spelling in post, as I'm sure everybody was as upset as you.

You have yourself a great rest of the day.

IMO, mclaugh did go a bit over board.  However, many people do read this forum and some are young students who don't have much experience.  It's good to make sure accurate information is out there.  That said, I wouldn't bother measuring your mouthpieces or mine for that matter.  It wouldn't be the first time for Bach to have inconsistencies in their machining.  Regardless of how accurate their machining and labeling may be, there is (supposed to be) more to the differences in mouthpieces than large/small shank.  That's all I was trying to say and didn't intend to come off as rude to anyone.

- Dan

Quote from: mclaugh on Sep 17, 2009, 11:55AMA digital caliper that can measure in .001 mm increments with ±.0005 mm accuracy can be bought for less than $40. which is a helluva lot more accurate than eyeballing how far a quarter fits in the mpc cup.

Nobody cares HOW long or how often you've been playing your mpcs, how you use them, or whether or not YOU notice a difference. Bottom line: if your "facts" are wrong, they're wrong, and need to be corrected.

And, while we're at it, it's bErp, Buzz Extension and Resistance Piece, not bUrp.

We all get hung up in equipment some times. All trombone players in the world can agree with that statement. Both young, old, pro and amateur.
Confusion? Yes I think most trombone players can agree they have been experienced that once or twice.

Its so easy to tell people what they should do. The most easy thing to say is not be confused. Will it help? No.
Stop thinking about equipment and have fun and play? No it will not help.   Practice? No......

What then?   I have just one answear: To be confused is some times  OK and its good. Try to get your own answear. Have a teacher help you. Ask questions here in the trombone forum, listen music and be open minded, don't hurry take your time, try everything. But most of all try enjoying your own sound, try enjoy the music you make, try to figure out all what is good with your playing. And try to forget the equipment.


There was a professor in trumpet playing in Norway. (This is a story and I don't know if it is true but I think it is.)  His students found a really bad trumpet in a music shop. They ask their professor to try it and told him this was a really good trumpet. The professor did play Haydn very well on it and told the students this is a really good trumpet. And he left the store. That's a lesson but maybe not a true story? Maybe it is.

People in poor countries make music out of everything. We use calibers to make sure we can make music out from our expensive equipment ?

Anyway McLaugh, try what Sam say:  Everything, but throw your caliper a long way.

Thanks, the only thing I can offer is my personal experience. If somebody uses a digital caliper incorrectly, and posts their result, should we take it that the user, the mouthpiece or the equipment is faulty? How would we ever know?

If I can't see the difference in my mouthpieces, I'm free to say that. There may be a huge difference to you when you play it. Also, you can measure it and show me I should have felt a difference. Still, maybe I can't. Do what works for you. You paid the same for my advice as everyone else's. Your soft machine is different from mine.

I've also have two mouthpieces from the same manufacturer. Both are labelled 12C, but one is a 6 1/2 AL. I didn't need calipers to tell they were different, although simple measurements confirmed it. (The factory sent me another 6 1/2 AL.)

Just sayin'

As for spelling, we do our best. Few entries are flawless. Again, figure it out. Most people can. I try my best, and I correct what needs fixing. That's easy to do, and I also am interested in being correct. Also, I learn from other posters. The strength of a good forum is the collective wisdom of everybody.

Finally, if young students are reading this forum, what example of behavior do you want to show?

Takk, Savio.

Martin

PS. My footer is intentionally reversed, if you hadn't noticed. That's called humour.

Martin,

The Vacum Cleaner is one of your instruments and my 1st choice among all instruments. 


Regards

Leif

Quote from: mclaugh on Sep 17, 2009, 11:55AMA digital caliper that can measure in .001 mm increments with ±.0005 mm accuracy can be bought for less than $40.

While you're correcting everybody else, you just might want to know the difference between millimeters and inches.  The numbers you quoted are inches, not mm.

This reminds me of selling stereo gear in the 80s.

You'd get the pseudo-sophisticate who smokes his pipe, and stroke his chin, and ask, 'What's the total harmonic distortion on this amplifier?'

Of course we always knew all the specs cold (because there's lots of down time, and after a while you get tired of everyone's same old stories, so you have to entertain yourself by actually learning about the products you're selling).

Still, I'd always ask, "I don't know, what's it sound like the THD is?"

In other words, if you can't hear it, who cares?

When I studied with Dr. Fink, he told me I should be using a Remington with my 88H because it was made for the horn.  I bought one.  But, on the other hand, Dr. Fink used a Schilke mouthpiece on his 88H (forget the exact one he used though).  It seemed to be a bathtub compared to the Remington.

I guess I should add that at one time I played a 5GS on tenor and bass.  I was first learning and it was all I had.  Although I was getting paid to play in the Army Band at the time.  Short story, there is no MOS for BASS trombone(or at least wasn't at that time).  So no one is going to play one regularly since you bump around in parts 1st, 2nd, sometimes 3rd or lower depending on the gig and who's available for it.  700+ gigs a year, even after 30 days of block leave in a given year.  Anyway, no brownie points for playing bass.  Anyway back to the 5GS.  Typical July 4th gig, I got tired of playing the part I was on, so I thought that I'd take up Bass to make it more interesting.  Tried as I might to honk out 1812 on a Bass with a 5GS, it was not easy going.

Basically don't get mouthpiece-itis.  This is my piece and I'm sticking to it no matter what.  Each horn IMO has a piece that it favors.  Which may not have any relation to the piece that you typically use.  Don't be affraid to try something different.  I tend to play mostly marching horns these days and those favor some pretty whacked pieces relative to their non-marching counterparts.  Some of which fall into that specification gap 26mm-27mm.  Too small and everything is stuffy.  Too big and the horns plays too flat to play in an ensemble.  I tend to favor an 11C for pea shooters.  And a 5GS for larger tenors.  But my Yamaha favors a G&W Harry Watters which is somewhere between the two.  Playing that horn on either of the other two makes for some unnecessary challenges.  If only for me.