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Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2024 11:53 pm
by BassPosaune
Hi all,
I have a Bach 50 BO I'd really like to add a second valve to. I've asked my teacher what I can do, and he gave me 2 options:
1. Buy a new valve section, put bell on new valve section
2. Put a new valve on the existing instrument
What would you guys do? Any price estimates? Thanks for any replies!
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2024 5:17 am
by SwissTbone
What valve do you have on your Bach 50? Traditional rotary valve?
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2024 5:31 am
by Matt K
If it’s a 50B you’ll have a little more trouble due to the bracing. Other models 50T, 50BO, etc. are a little easier. Whoever does the work will be able to give you the best answer. Ballpark you’re looking at 1k-~3K with 1k being “you
Got really lucky and got really cheap parts (which does happen from time to time which is why I even mention it. I’ve gotten lucky over the years personally )
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2024 7:22 am
by elmsandr
It’s probably cheaper and easier to buy a horn that already has two valves. But, more fun to do the work.
Finding a decent double valve section used takes time and flexibility. Figure out what you want and be constant in watching.
Good luck,
Andy
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2024 10:06 am
by BassPosaune
SwissTbone wrote: ↑Sun Jun 23, 2024 5:17 am
What valve do you have on your Bach 50? Traditional rotary valve?
Yes, just a normal rotor.
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2024 1:59 pm
by BassPosaune
Matt K wrote: ↑Sun Jun 23, 2024 5:31 am
If it’s a 50B you’ll have a little more trouble due to the bracing. Other models 50T, 50BO, etc. are a little easier. Whoever does the work will be able to give you the best answer. Ballpark you’re looking at 1k-~3K with 1k being “you
Got really lucky and got really cheap parts (which does happen from time to time which is why I even mention it. I’ve gotten lucky over the years personally )
Thanks!
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2024 5:19 pm
by sf105
how much do you like this horn? Would you be better off looking to trade in for one with two valves.
[also, there is 3) get a plug-in valve made up]
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2024 9:30 pm
by hornbuilder
A plug in valve requires modifications to the existing valve wrap. It is NOT a simple job.
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2024 7:30 am
by elmsandr
As I’ve been staring at adding a plug in valve at my NY 50 for a couple of years now…. I’d rather replace the entire neckline and valve section with a different one as far as “work required”.
Grafting a new valve section on is relatively straightforward. Not $&$#^-ing up the current while adding a nice valve on is hard.
Cheers,
Andy
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2024 12:52 pm
by sf105
hornbuilder wrote: ↑Sun Jun 23, 2024 9:30 pm
A plug in valve requires modifications to the existing valve wrap. It is NOT a simple job.
Never said it was. But I've had one built for a horn I didn't want to cut. Turned out to be the right decision with advantage of being able to leave it off most of the time.
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2024 11:42 pm
by BassPosaune
sf105 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 23, 2024 5:19 pm
how much do you like this horn? Would you be better off looking to trade in for one with two valves.
[also, there is 3) get a plug-in valve made up]
I really like this horn, I'd really prefer to not sell it or trade it.
What is a plug in valve? I've never heard of this term before, could you give an explanation?
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2024 11:53 pm
by Burgerbob
BassPosaune wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 11:42 pm
sf105 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 23, 2024 5:19 pm
how much do you like this horn? Would you be better off looking to trade in for one with two valves.
[also, there is 3) get a plug-in valve made up]
I really like this horn, I'd really prefer to not sell it or trade it.
What is a plug in valve? I've never heard of this term before, could you give an explanation?
This isn't the way you would wrap it, but something like this
Really though, don't worry about it. You want a new valve section. I'd recommend finding something like a used Shires or Edwards section and having the horn built around that, if you're on a medium sized budget.
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2024 12:04 am
by BassPosaune
Burgerbob wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 11:53 pm
BassPosaune wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 11:42 pm
I really like this horn, I'd really prefer to not sell it or trade it.
What is a plug in valve? I've never heard of this term before, could you give an explanation?
This isn't the way you would wrap it, but something like this
Really though, don't worry about it. You want a new valve section. I'd recommend finding something like a used Shires or Edwards section and having the horn built around that, if you're on a medium sized budget.
Thanks for the advice!
Huh, that is one weird looking trombone.
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2024 1:50 am
by SwissTbone
Actually you'll be probably better off finding a 50b2 used. They can come up at good prices.
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Thu Jul 04, 2024 8:31 pm
by MichaelMedrick
Someday you'll wish you had just found a second double valve bell. I'm at a phase of life where i am playing local symphony( a lot of pops), chamber music and shows on bass trombone. A single valve does the job and weighs less. Your hand and wrist will thank you.
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sat Jul 13, 2024 7:30 am
by whitbey
So many players are upgrading the valves on the trombones that you might find an ok valve set for cheap.
Suggestion that fits well with an independent system. Make the tubing on the 2nd valve a little larger. That will balance the blow and make the horn feel very in balance. I did this to my Bach bass with a dependent Bb/F/C setup.
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sat Jul 13, 2024 12:39 pm
by brassmedic
Burgerbob wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 11:53 pm
This isn't the way you would wrap it, but something like this
What the....? So many questions.
Re: Attaching 2nd valve to Bach 50
Posted: Sat Jul 13, 2024 3:31 pm
by CalgaryTbone
That wrap wouldn't work in most pits or in the back row in most concert halls - no chance of having that much space behind you. Not very practical!
Jim Scott