TromboneChat

You should immediately reach out to Sasha. This is in poor taste at best unless you cleared it with her first.

WilliamLang wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 12:37 pm You should immediately reach out to Sasha. This is in poor taste at best unless you cleared it with her first.

This x1000.

I would also add that unless Sasha cleared this, or says she is ok with it as is, I think it warrants a ban from this forum. I do not say this lightly or without thought.

This has almost nothing to do with trombone.

I think this post & this video steps on some pretty thin ice, if not directly into water...

I didn't watch the video. Here's a suggestion to everyone out there:

Do like me. Put this guy on your ignore list amd don't support him by watching his stupid videos.

Actually.... he achieved something nobody else on the old forum or here on TC achieved. Making it on my ignore list is quite an achievement!

Haters gonna hate

trombonejb wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 5:30 pm Haters gonna hate

As a trombonist who is on the trans spectrum, it's not about being a hater, it's about genuine concern of your publication of a video out about a trans person was done with her permission and input or if it's exclusively the voice of a cis man. That's not hate, that's like pretty basic respect towards Sasha. For many trans people this is also is a very serious and direct issue of their personal safety so such a flippant response is honest very concerning a big issue is whether or not Sasha had input and gave permission cause it's really messed up if she did not.

SwissTbone wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 2:11 pm I didn't watch the video. Here's a suggestion to everyone out there:

Do like me. Put this guy on your ignore list amd don't support him by watching his stupid videos.

Actually.... he achieved something nobody else on the old forum or here on TC achieved. Making it on my ignore list is quite an achievement!

How do you ignore someone if you acknowledge them in a reply comment?

trombonejb wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 5:30 pm Haters gonna hate

TribuneJB, you say of yourself in the video that you "actually give a s*** about people" when all of your content is monetized or formerly monetized, or content that YouTube removed, that consists of videos exploiting people for your own gain and sometimes using people's identities as LGBTQ+ to do that, or plagiarizing people's work, or straight up infringing on their copyright protected media. You had a "documentary" that you did about a really young trombonist that felt like pure exploitation to me, not genuine. People here seemed to think it was cool, but it looked like a FB rip to me. So you could promote your own channel and slap ads on it. I don't think there is anything wrong with being self serving, but do it without exploiting or tearing down others, using their names and likenesses. Do it with your own ideas, or by challenging ideas with your own thoughts, or through your own merit.

It looks to me like you and Romero indeed collaborated on this video, with the interview and light saber sequence, but I find it hard to imagine that a professional would want this as the final product. She really approved this?

I think your line at 4:02 says it all, and is one of the most self-serving, embarrassing things you could have possibly said. "Even though I myself am not XYZ or anything, check out this great thing I am doing sharing this news with you"

I can't believe you would actually say that.

harrisonreed wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 7:42 pm

trombonejb wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 5:30 pm Haters gonna hate

You had a "documentary" that you did about a really young trombonist that felt like pure exploitation to me, not genuine.

I was coordinating with that young child's mother, Laura, for the whole 6 months during the development of that documentary. I have hundreds of messages of correspondence between me and her during that time period as well.

To your point on asking for permission first - I don't legally need to do so. Plus, it's better to do first and later ask for forgiveness as opposed to asking for permission. I know that's kinda sketch to do in the trombone world but I'm not a pro trombonist myself so I'm kinda well off in that regard unlike most others.

I will add that I thought Sasha’s playing - what I heard - was excellent.

Don't want to go into copyright topics etc. because I don't have much clue on that myself.
Generally speaking I had the impression that these videos are more or less the same way copied content as many other Youtube stuff.

On the content:
I think in the past there were a few interviews that may have been interesting to some although they are more on the less professional end. Not sure if these are still available as I understand some content has been blocked.
On the other hand there have been a number of videos that were at least for myself clearly within the range of bad taste.
It's partly the content itself but partly also the way it is presented in a partly disrespectful way.

While I am generally a proponent of free opinion and doing what's legally and morally accepted and perception of the last point may vary:
I am not yet an old man (maybe from your perspective?), but still would like to share a recommendation to the originator of this stuff.
You may not be or aim to be a professional, but you obviously want to be involved in the community.
Be more respectful of other people. I think it's not so much the actual topics, but more the way you present them and the attitude that some of us perceive from the presentation.
The internet doesn't forget and in 10 years you might view this differently. Maybe not.

trombonejb wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 9:41 pm To your point on asking for permission first - I don't legally need to do so.

Much of the video seems like copyright violations if permission wasn't gained.

"Fair use is the doctrine that brief excerpts of copyrighted material can be used verbatim for purposes without the need for permission from or payment to the copyright holder."

That is a self-serving understatement of the limitations of "fair use".

I'm not convinced the video would meet the real tests of "fair use."

Plus, it's better to do first and later ask for forgiveness as opposed to asking for permission.

"Better" in that sentence really only means "easier".

That's not a law or even a principle of journalism. It was just a joke.

The person who originated that comment was talking about how it was easier to do pioneering work without asking her superiors first. She wasn't talking about regurgitating other people's work.

And it only holds up if there was success at the end to trade for the failure to ask permission. The more common situation of failure after not getting permission first are the reason most of us live in a world where our superiors insist on being informed of what's going on.

One addition - not that my opinion would be especially important.

I do not find this to be a reason for exclusion from this forum as suggested by someone above.
Yes, it's bad taste and many of us do not like it.
But it is not openly anti minorities or individuals and I am convinced it's not meant this way, just badly made in an attempt to gain visibility and clicks...

I would suggest seeing this as an annoying an inappropriate action from a comparably young person who hopefully still learns something from it.
And I want to add one more point towards the originator: In case you consider "youtubing on trombone/brass" as (part of) your career, better do something else instead of trying to build visibility in this inappropriate way.

trombonejb wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 9:41 pm To your point on asking for permission first - I don't legally need to do so.

I guess you're right, you don't legally need to be a decent human being. Thanks for clearing that up...

+1 to the recommendation to ignore this guy's posts, and wouldn't be against a ban. Beyond the extreme bad taste of most of the production in most of his videos, he's shown consistently that he has no respect or consideration for other members of our community and will use them, their likeness, their original content and/or their work for his own gain. There's a clear pattern of abusive behaviour towards individuals and our community generally, and he's not even hiding it, as seen above.

LeTromboniste wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 10:00 am

trombonejb wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 9:41 pm To your point on asking for permission first - I don't legally need to do so.

I guess you're right, you don't legally need to be a decent human being. Thanks for clearing that up...

+1 to the recommendation to ignore this guy's posts, and wouldn't be against a ban. Beyond the extreme bad taste of most of the production in most of his videos, he's shown consistently that he has no respect or consideration for other members of our community and will use them, their likeness, their original content and/or their work for his own gain. There's a clear pattern of abusive behaviour towards individuals and our community generally, and he's not even hiding it, as seen above.

Well put......

Terrible person makes another questionable video?

Seriously, please ban this person. They have had the opportunity to learn and continue to demonstrate that they have no intention of being decent.

Cheers,
Andy

elmsandr wrote: ↑Mon Jul 18, 2022 11:22 am Terrible person makes another questionable video?

Seriously, please ban this person. They have had the opportunity to learn and continue to demonstrate that they have no intention of being decent.

+1

Not many defenders.

trombonejb wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 9:41 pm
I was coordinating with that young child's mother, Laura, for the whole 6 months during the development of that documentary. I have hundreds of messages of correspondence between me and her during that time period as well.

Correspondence does not equal permission. Permission is a specific act that all parties acknowledge. Another related term is informed consent. It means that the person who is sharing information with you has been informed of the uses of that information and any possible consequences. I have my doubts whether trombonejb requested permission, and informed the individuals about the ramifications of publishing said correspondence.

trombonejb wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 9:41 pm
To your point on asking for permission first - I don't legally need to do so. Plus, it's better to do first and later ask for forgiveness as opposed to asking for permission. I know that's kinda sketch to do in the trombone world but I'm not a pro trombonist myself so I'm kinda well off in that regard unlike most others.

This is what I object to: “I know it’s kinda sketch in the trombone world…” Then why on earth would you do such a thing? If your conscience and your sense of decency were already giving you pause, you should have listened to yourself and stopped what you were doing.

Your statement, “…but I’m not a pro trombonist myself…” is no excuse. In fact, if you ever had any desire to become a professional trombonist, I believe you have just dashed your own hopes by shooting yourself in the foot.

Whenever you meet with minors or persons of a marginalized community (however that is interpreted), reasonable and caring people will ask permission before publishing any content. For sensitive information, e.g., medical records, consent and authorizations are legally required. Explicit written permission is legally required for minors—the parents must sign an authorization. I hope you have these, and I hope you have one for all the people you mention.

As an aside, I hope that the bass trombonist from the Marinsky Theater has some repercussions from his posts. And by the way, I hope you received explicit permission from the parent of that young girl, and I hope you received permission to post information about the Met trombonist. I doubt you even obtained permission to post the private correspondence from him.

I would add that this kind of attitude is behind much of the “change” we see in this world, change that is justified by the phrase, “what is not expressly forbidden is allowed.” Just because you can do something—it’s not forbidden—doesn’t mean you should. It may be an acceptable doctrine under Article II in US constitutional law, but it doesn’t work if you want to be an accepted member of a community. This approach will quickly alienate you. I believe it already has.

For my part, I would ask the moderators to discuss seriously whether TC should allow such insensitive, puerile, objectionable and tacky nonsense, and discuss banning the individual trombonejb from this forum.

As a trans woman, this video made me genuinely nauseous.
"I'm not gay or anything...", then proceeds to recite a laundry list of slurs that were weaponized against a trans woman.
Please, stop making videos. They're garbage

gracytomek wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 1:46 pm As a trans woman, this video made me genuinely nauseous.
"I'm not gay or anything...", then proceeds to recite a laundry list of slurs that were weaponized against a trans woman.
Please, stop making videos. They're garbage

--Andy in OKC

gracytomek wrote: ↑Wed Jul 20, 2022 1:46 pm As a trans woman, this video made me genuinely nauseous.
"I'm not gay or anything...", then proceeds to recite a laundry list of slurs that were weaponized against a trans woman.
Please, stop making videos. They're garbage

Yeah, that's what I was referring to as well. No matter what you put after that statement, it's not going to be positive.

This behavior is pathetic.

So I live in a cave and knew nothing about this artist, nor the OP, until now. First off, great playing by Sasha, and an inspiring story in making a career happen! OTOH, if this was promulgated without Sasha's clear consent, then it is horsesh**t. OP might fancy themself to be a journalist, but there are state-based legal rights of privacy and rights of publicity that are more likely to govern this story than purported First Amendment concerns - and "fair use" is an utter red herring, with no bearing on what's happened here. Rights to control unauthorized use of image and likeness vary from state, and IIRC, are press-friendly in NY, while CA is artist-friendly. Anyhow, if Sasha is not on board with this dissemination, I hope they can lawyer up - hard. And "I'm not gay?" Really? Who cares? Is this post about the artist in question, or about the OP's comfort zone? Again, I live in a cave and don't get out much, but I'm appalled to see someone appropriating this story to make their own, twisted point. Sheesh - I thought trombonists were section-oriented team players! Another illusion shattered...

Can someone tell me why the OP is still allowed to post this drivel here? This isn’t the first time they’ve done it and something needs to be done. This isn’t about “cancelling” or anything like that. The content is plainly offensive, amateurish, in this case insulting to Sasha and the transgender community and may even violate copyright in some cases. The fact that no one here is defending this except for the OP ought to be a clear signal this is unacceptable. The administration of this site can and must do better or I have no choice to believe they are OK with this. If that’s the case. I will reassess my desire to visit and participate.

Two good things for me about this kerfuffle:
1. Great support for diversity and tolerance from the TromboneChat community.
2. I have been introduced to the artistry of yet another very fine trombonist -
https://www.sasharomeromusic.com/videos

trombonejb wrote: ↑Sun Jul 17, 2022 9:41 pmTo your point on asking for permission first - I don't legally need to do so. Plus, it's better to do first and later ask for forgiveness as opposed to asking for permission.

Your habitual content thieving/copyright violations aside, this sort of behavior may not be technically criminal but it definitely does make you an asshole. Please just go away.

Where are the mods regarding this thread? It needs to be reviewed and consider whether it should be locked. I reported it this morning. I urge the OP to reflect inward regarding whom these videos and posts serve. It is clear they don't serve the trombonechat community. If you find this material is more about you or personal web stats then I recommend ceasing the creation of all media until you can definitely address the legality of your material and answer how this benefits the trombone community. Otherwise I recommend the OP be banned.

^ This.

Any mods around?…

Maybe they felt trombonejb hadn't been kicked enough?

Trombonejb is no longer a member of the forum. Locking this thread.