Schilke 58 with Conn 73H?

[BoneRob]

Hi all!

I have been using a Schilke 59 with my Conn 73H bass bone. I love it but it has always felt like it's just slightly too big for me. For a recent gig a friend lent me his Schilke 58 and I think this mouthpiece may be the one! I was doing some searching of this forum and discovered a thread that mentioned a long shank version that should be used with a Conn 72H. As mentioned, I play a 73H. If I buy a Schilke 58, should I try to find a long shank version? The one I borrowed worked fine, so what would I gain from a long shank? Would it just be a matter of slightly different tuning? Any info would be appreciated.

THANKS!

Rob

[Burgerbob]

The longer (old) shanks fit both Morse and Remington tapers. Most trombones have a Morse taper receiver, older Conns have a Remington receiver. Morse mouthpieces don't really fit in old Conns as a result, and play a little worse (as well as damaging the receiver over time).

If you haven't been using a long shank yet, it may be a better choice. There's other Remington shank mouthpieces out there, of course.

[Thrawn22]

Or change your leadpipe. But most pre texas bassbones in my experience have Remington shanks.

[Kevbach33]

While in high school I had a similar experience: I would sometimes play a Conn 71H (single valve to your double valve 73H) with a long shank Schilke 59. Granted, as a tuba player at the time the rim size didn't faze me. Nevertheless, when I graduated there was a nagging thought in my mind: "That horn/mouthpiece combo wasn't right. That's not the sound this bass should have." I wanted to give back to the program somehow, and this was the right horn to do it with.

It wasn't until very recently that I had the opportunity to give back, and to find out what the right size mouthpiece could do in that horn. When the current 1st band bass trombonist played the new combo, the BD and the two of us were astonished. What a sound! Beautiful color and sizzle, the likes of which I hadn't heard in my 3 years there. I don't know if that horn ever spoke with that kind of voice. I was kinda envious, TBH. We all agreed that this will really help the 2nd band bass trombonist (there was only one jazz band in my time) develop into a better player.

You won't go wrong with the 58 since it'll be cheaper than any Conn 3B in good shape. (I had to buy a whole trombone to get one of these, and I donated the 3B to the school for said 71H.) Yes, the 3B is the true right piece for the horn, but a 58 will definitely suffice. Your 73H will awaken with one since the 7xH basses tend to favor medium size mouthpieces.

And yes, find a long shank version; the current short shank Schilke may bottom out at the knurling. There is a consensus that the long Schilke pieces just play better than current production, and almost certainly have better intonation in the Conn basses.

Kinda rambled there...

[CBlair]

So, is the Schilke "long shank" different than the Schilke Remington shank style? (The Horn Guys have a separate listing.)

FURTHER COMMENTS. I have an Elkhart 73H and two 1970s era Schilkes, 58 and 60, and a Bach 1-1/2G. The 58, unfortunately, had the rim got flattened when I kept it upside down in a car cupholder to buzz while commuting. When in high school, I used the 60 which, as discussed in numerous threads, makes trigger and pedal notes easier to hit, but not in a disciplined manner. My upper registered suffered, but that didn't seem as important at the time. I switched to the Bach 1-1/5G in college, which allowed the mid and upper range to play great, but - for me - it rather loses that beefier bass trombone sound down low. More recently, I got a long shank Bach 1-1/4G, which I rather like, except that is suffers from the issues discussed here and elsewhere. Basically, it seats too far in. And I don't want to damage the horn. I was thinking about trying out the Schilke 59 as a good compromise, but I want to get the shank right.

Burgerbob mentions there are other Remington shank mouthpieces - who's making them?
CBlair

[Kevbach33]

So, is the Schilke "long shank" different than the Schilke Remington shank style? (The Horn Guys have a separate listing.)

My understanding is the Schilke Remington shank mouthpiece has that taper all the way through.

Burgerbob explained the older long shank. Basically most of the shank (about 1 1/16" or so) is standard Morse taper (.050"/inch) for the majority of horns, but the rest is the slower Remington taper (about .040"/inch as i recall reading) to properly seat in the old Conn leadpipes (and the current .547" Conn R pipe). This results in a longer mouthpiece than the current large shank Schilke pieces.

[johntarr]

So, is the Schilke "long shank" different than the Schilke Remington shank style? (The Horn Guys have a separate listing.)

FURTHER COMMENTS. I have an Elkhart 73H and two 1970s era Schilkes, 58 and 60, and a Bach 1-1/2G. The 58, unfortunately, had the rim got flattened when I kept it upside down in a car cupholder to buzz while commuting. When in high school, I used the 60 which, as discussed in numerous threads, makes trigger and pedal notes easier to hit, but not in a disciplined manner. My upper registered suffered, but that didn't seem as important at the time. I switched to the Bach 1-1/5G in college, which allowed the mid and upper range to play great, but - for me - it rather loses that beefier bass trombone sound down low. More recently, I got a long shank Bach 1-1/4G, which I rather like, except that is suffers from the issues discussed here and elsewhere. Basically, it seats too far in. And I don't want to damage the horn. I was thinking about trying out the Schilke 59 as a good compromise, but I want to get the shank right.

Burgerbob mentions there are other Remington shank mouthpieces - who's making them?
CBlair

Doug Elliott makes a Conn Remington shank that fits perfectly into my 72H. An additional advantage is the you can try different cups and rims to get something that works really well, imho.

[BoneRob]

Thanks for all the info everybody! I purchased a regular large shank Schilke 58, then found a long shank 58 on the forum here and bought it as well. I've only had one practice where I switched back and forth between those two a little. I'll play with that idea more in the future just to see. BTW the regular shank one fits just fine. The Remington mouthpiece and Schilke 59 I had been using are both long shanks as well, so I'll stick with the long shank 58. So far I think it may be the perfect fit for me.