Who in their right mind plays a Bach 1 1/2G ??

[ttf_CRWV]

Quote from: blast on Jan 14, 2008, 01:39PMMy reasons for using the 1 1/2G are tonal.... I have pretty well the same range on big and small mouthpieces.... it seems that the 1 1/2G size is the one that gets me to the sound I want most easily... simple as that.
Other people will find different things working for them... but I must say that I find people with a macho attitude to mouthpieces a little pathetic.... they tend to have interesting musical opinions too 
Chris Stearn.

I have an old recording of me on bass bone doing (read: destroying) the pines of rome that I'm not proud of. I give it a listen mostly for laughs. (and in my defense I kept getting the "more" signal from the conductor...or was he looking at the tympanist....

Edit: I can no longer do that with a normal sized mouthpiece, compared to the bathtub/noleadpipe combo I was using.

[ttf_Dan H.]

Quote from: CRWV on Jan 14, 2008, 01:49PMI have an old recording of me on bass bone doing (read: destroying) the pines of rome that I'm not proud of. I give it a listen mostly for laughs. (and in my defense I kept getting the "more" signal from the conductor...or was he looking at the tympanist....

Edit: I can no longer do that with a normal sized mouthpiece, compared to the bathtub/noleadpipe combo I was using.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but a 2G is a rather small bass trombone mouthpiece.

[ttf_GetzenBassPlayer]

Quote from: Bonefide on Jan 13, 2008, 06:19PMIn what setting were you taking some of Spain up an octave on a bass bone?  I find it hard to imagine that being tasteful, unless done in a solo or something.   


That is because you are in high school and probably do not have a good grasp of the basic bass trombone rep. Blair did David Fetter's Spain, which is an unaccompanied solo for bass trombone on his Fancy Free CD. Blair plays on pretty large equipment. You can hear it in his sound. He is a great player. There are some very challenging pieces on that CD The short pieces he transcribed for bass bone from the flute rep. are really beautiful and rarely go beneath the staff, if at all. He makes them sing.

[ttf_CRWV]

I, at the time, was using a hammond 21BL that I was wrapping some tape around and putting in, sans leadpipe

It was fun...More of a pissing contest than music.

I only recently went to a 1.5G and subsequently a rath 2

[ttf_Bonefide]

Quote from: GetzenBassPlayer on Jan 14, 2008, 09:31PMThat is because you are in high school and probably do not have a good grasp of the basic bass trombone rep. Blair did David Fetter's Spain, which is an unaccompanied solo for bass trombone on his Fancy Free CD. Blair plays on pretty large equipment. You can hear it in his sound. He is a great player. There are some very challenging pieces on that CD The short pieces he transcribed for bass bone from the flute rep. are really beautiful and rarely go beneath the staff, if at all. He makes them sing.
You caught me! My relationship with bass trombone is nearly 1 year young, and our anniversary is quickly sneaking up on me.  I can't afford to run around and grab all the wonderful CDs I hear about frequently, but I have been meaning to get a few bass trombone discs to balance out the crazy high tromboning in my music library.

Just like to point out that I did tag on the disclaimer "unless done in a solo or something."  I know, I'm a wordsmith.   Clearly my comment was directed towards what I assumed to be a rendition of Corea's work.  *slaps self on wrist*  Need to do my research next time!

[ttf_Richard Lillard]

Quote from: GetzenBassPlayer on Jan 14, 2008, 09:31PMThat is because you are in high school and probably do not have a good grasp of the basic bass trombone rep. Blair did David Fetter's Spain, which is an unaccompanied solo for bass trombone on his Fancy Free CD. Blair plays on pretty large equipment. You can hear it in his sound. He is a great player. There are some very challenging pieces on that CD The short pieces he transcribed for bass bone from the flute rep. are really beautiful and rarely go beneath the staff, if at all. He makes them sing.


Which ones are the Flute rep?  I'm pretty sure the Ibert was Alto Sax rep, but which one was originally for Flutes?


Richard

[ttf_CRWV]

Quote from: Richard Lillard on Jan 14, 2008, 11:10PM
Which ones are the Flute rep?  I'm pretty sure the Ibert was Alto Sax rep, but which one was originally for Flutes?


Richard

the Histoires for Flute and Piano.

[ttf_Richard Lillard]

The Histoires are for Alto and Piano.


Richard

[ttf_GetzenBassPlayer]

He wrote them for both.Look on this Amazon website toward the bottom where it says On This CD.http://www.amazon.com/French-Saxophone-Roger-Boutry/dp/B00000169W#moreAboutThisProduct

[ttf_GetzenBassPlayer]

Quote from: Bonefide on Jan 14, 2008, 11:10PMJust like to point out that I did tag on the disclaimer "unless done in a solo or something."  I know, I'm a wordsmith.   Clearly my comment was directed towards what I assumed to be a rendition of Corea's work.  *slaps self on wrist*  Need to do my research next time!

I also thought I was being clear when I mentioned that Blair Bollinger was the player of the piece.

[ttf_Jox]

Bollinger should do the other movements of Bass Lines.

[ttf_savio]

Hi all Bass trombone players.

I don't think Mr. Stearn believed this tread to be so long. He says he started it because Mr Kleinhammer once didn't see the use of a 1 1/2 in a modern orchestra. . Mr Kleinammer and George Roberts is maybe the most known bass trombone players who played the Bach 1 1/2g. Jeff Reynolds also used this in his record "the big trombone" very nice.

I did buy 2 CD´s of  Paul Pollard Denson  and don't know what mouthpiece he is using but I love listening to  his playing so much.Its just fantastic bass trombone playing both musically and the recording is also done very natural (maybe with a big mouthpiece I believe?) 

About mouthpieces the most important thing is to stay with one. We can read about all this pro players on this forum changing and trying and telling us whats good and bad with mouthpieces. 

Griego, Hammond, Rath, Laskey, Yeo they are all good, And all this pro players can make any mouthpiece sound good. Both big and small. They are just fine tuning them self into their place in the orchestra or where ever they play.

I have learned from this tread that among all these new and fine mouthpieces the old bach is still a good mouthpiece and that both "big and small" can be fine. But most important that a smaller mouthpiece still can be a good choice for any bass trombone player. And maybe be a good choice for us who don't play every day and make our playing more easy and musically.

I think the clue for a young student or any player is to find his mouthpiece very early and stay with it and make his playing firm
Then making progress. And then make adjustment with both mouthpieces and instruments with help from a teacher. I also think all of us need some help when changing
 
So this tread open my mind about mouthpieces. But also was a bit dangerous because I wanted to try all of them. 

They all can look nice  but best to stay with one in the long run. 

Leif 



Stay with one and you make progress.

[ttf_blast]

Wise words indeed Leif....
younger, developing players need to get a good middle-of-the-road mouthpiece and stick to it.
Keeping equipment stable at times of development is essential....
When a good degree of stability is reached then equipment choice may be developed.
Choice can be good and bad...depends how you use it.
You are right Leif, when I started this thread I had no idea it would run like it has.
Tomorrow I will hear two of my students play recitals... one is British, one American..
one plays a Conn 70H with a Rath 1 1/2G, the other a Thayer equipped Bach 50B with a Hammond 21BX ?
I expect to enjoy both recitals equally as they are both fine musicians who happen to play the bass trombone.
Equipment is secondary to musicianship.... but they and I... and lots of others, will continue to consider the merits of the tools we use, both face to face and here on the forum... it's human nature. 
Chris Stearn.

[ttf_anonymous]

Hey Leif, He plays on the Laskey bass trombone mpc's. 85MD, 93D, and 95D. I have both of his cds as well. He's an awesome player and a very gracious guy to correspond with

As far as the 1 1/2G goes I've tried variations of it and even did the undreadful thing of trying to play bathtubs, but I always come back to the good ole' 1 1/2G. Also, does anyone know of a good 1.5-1.25 size mouthpiece with a comfortable rim (not too thick, but not razor thin) and with a fairly sized cup depth. I've got a list of ones I want to try. Some good and maybe some bad. Any suggestions? Chris?

[ttf_Birdy]

Quote from: JSU BassBone Player on Jan 27, 2008, 10:16AMHey Leif, He plays on the Laskey bass trombone mpc's. 85MD, 93D, and 95D. I have both of his cds as well. He's an awesome player and a very gracious guy to correspond with

As far as the 1 1/2G goes I've tried variations of it and even did the undreadful thing of trying to play bathtubs, but I always come back to the good ole' 1 1/2G. Also, does anyone know of a good 1.5-1.25 size mouthpiece with a comfortable rim (not too thick, but not razor thin) and with a fairly sized cup depth. I've got a list of ones I want to try. Some good and maybe some bad. Any suggestions? Chris?

My own personal preference is the Schilke 58. Feels like a 1.5g on the face, but is more comfortable. The cup looks to be ever so slightly deeper as well.

[ttf_JSU BassBone Player]

Thanks Birdy, I have been looking at it for a bit and considering it. I left out that I need a mouthpiece that works in different situations. I'm jazz, concert, and orchestra. So, I need one that is a good all around mouthpiece. I've palyed schilke's before and I know that they are great mouthpieces and great to play on. Just want to be sure before I make the final decision.

[ttf_bonesmarsh]

Don't forget that the shank on a stock Schilke mouthpiece is a different taper than a Bach, and will stick out further, making the horn flat. Sure, it changes the blow of the horn, but if your tuning slide is already pushed in or almost all the way in, you'll have to cut the horn to make a Schilke work sometimes.

When the old Schilke 60 was leading the way in the orchestral "bigger is better" wars a lot of guys had chopped Bach horns.....because that was pretty much all that was available to orchestral players at the time.

Try before you buy, and bring a tuner.

[ttf_blast]

Quote from: JSU BassBone Player on Jan 27, 2008, 10:16AMHey Leif, He plays on the Laskey bass trombone mpc's. 85MD, 93D, and 95D. I have both of his cds as well. He's an awesome player and a very gracious guy to correspond with

As far as the 1 1/2G goes I've tried variations of it and even did the undreadful thing of trying to play bathtubs, but I always come back to the good ole' 1 1/2G. Also, does anyone know of a good 1.5-1.25 size mouthpiece with a comfortable rim (not too thick, but not razor thin) and with a fairly sized cup depth. I've got a list of ones I want to try. Some good and maybe some bad. Any suggestions? Chris?

Of the modern generation of 1 1/2G sized mouthpieces with a regular rim, my favourites are the Rath B1.5 and the Greg Black 1 1/2G.
Chris Stearn.

[ttf_Ellrod]

I acquired a Greg Black 1 1/2G about 6 weeks ago (after following this thread).  I had been playing a 1 1/4 sized Kanstul and a Bach 1 1/2 G prior to that (and prior to that a D. Elliott).

The Black has been interesting.  It seems to be the most revealing mpc I have ever played.  For example, I noticed what felt like instability or turbulence in the airstream and, upon taking my horn apart, I found a blob of goo in my leadpipe.  Removing that obstruction and cleaning out the pipe made a big difference.  I hadn't even noticed the problem with the previous mpcs.

It's taken me some time to get a handle on the Black but in the 6 weeks or so I've been playing it, it's really grown on me.  I think it is one of the best mpcs (of any size) that I've played.

[ttf_JSU BassBone Player]

Hey guys, thanks, only thing is, I would love to get a black or a rath, but I'm kind of on a budget. So, I'm having to look at affordable mpc's. If money wasn't an issue I would have already ordered something like a rath, black, or some other brand. But, unfortuantely I can't. Thank You though.

Here are some of my prospects:
Schilke 57
Wick 0AL
Holton 1 1/2G
Giardinelli 1G
Yamaha 59
Bach 1 1/2G
Bach 1 1/4GM

I don't really want to venture too far out of the 1 1/2-1 1/4G range. Thanks guys.

[ttf_bonesmarsh]

A 1 1/2G better than a Bach?

Try the faxx from hornguys. Price incredible. Quality incredible.

[ttf_EarlNeedham]

Hey, JSU, I see you mentioned the Giardinelli 1G.  I used to have one, but lost it somewhere along the way.

Thirty years ago, you could get Giardinelli mouthpieces with a screw rim, and they were just the thing -- you could get the 1G, 2G, or 3G with a spare, shallower cup underpart -- in effect, you got (for example) a 1G and a 1GM for a bit less money, but the benefit was that you always used the same rim.  The tenor mouthpieces, were similar, but the numbers were a bit different -- a 4D and a 4M, for instance.

I wish they were still available -- a 4D with a semi-flat rim is NICE in something like an 88H.

[ttf_JohnL]

Quote from: JSU BassBone Player on Jan 27, 2008, 06:08PMSo, I'm having to look at affordable mpc's.

I don't really want to venture too far out of the 1 1/2-1 1/4G range. Thanks guys.
If you're tight on cash, you might want to consider a Faxx 1-1/2G. Heck, even if you're not tight on cash, you still might want to look at one. It's a well-made copy of a Bach 1-1/2G (Mt. Vernon vintage, I believe).

[ttf_JSU BassBone Player]

Hey, thanks for more input, always helpful. I have played a Bach 1 1/2G in the past and it was a really great piece I had no complaints with it, but it was borroed and by the time I swapped to bass the person had already gotten rid of it. I had a faxx, but have since sold it. It was a great piece, only drawback to it was the cup depth could have been a little deeper. I'm currently using a Wick 1AL I traded to a friend. I'm using it untill I make a final decision. I really like the Wick, which is why I'm considering the 0AL. I was wondering if anybody could give me some feedback about the 0AL. Also, is buying a Bach 1 1/2G a good idea? I've heard mixed stories about them. Since last trying one.

Also, are the Giardinelli's of today the same quality as the ones you speak of? Was the rim comfortable and was the cup depth somewhat deep, deeper than lets say the faxx? Sorry to ask so many questions, but this mouthpiece is going to be my last one for a very long time. Thanks for all of ya'lls help. 

[ttf_GetzenBassPlayer]

Quote from: JSU BassBone Player on Jan 27, 2008, 09:34PMAlso, is buying a Bach 1 1/2G a good idea? I've heard mixed stories about them. Since last trying one.


Bach is the standard that most used to compare and describe other 1.5g. Knowing how the Bach plays will help make other piece descriptions make more sense.

[ttf_JSU BassBone Player]

True, that makes sense. Thanks, it might seem really tedious what I'm doing, but I'm getting to a point where me and mouthpiece need to settle down for a while and I've finally tried different kinds and know what I want, just have to find the one that comes closest to my needs.

[ttf_second.chance]

JSU... If you really want a Bach 1.5G then PM your address to me and I'll give you one of severalo I have gathering dust. Cost you the postage, which will be about $10 from the UK. Blasts comments are the most accurate on here and I concur with what he says about the 1.5, I dont use a Bach anymore but I'm still on a derivative of it, you'll do fine with it if you settle down and keep using it... Doug

[ttf_Thomas Matta]

I still flirt with the 1.5G in my bass.

I haven't had the time to develop the same dependable low range as I enjoy on a Schilke 60 or Griego .5, but the SOUND of the 1.5G is pure bass trombone, heck - just pure trombone is a better way to put it.

I highly suggest some of you nay-sayers to do a side-by-side test using a 1.5G vs. your current boss hog mouthpiece. The focus and core of the sound from the smaller mouthpiece might shock some of you!!

[ttf_blast]

Quote from: second.chance on Jan 28, 2008, 12:08AMJSU... If you really want a Bach 1.5G then PM your address to me and I'll give you one of severalo I have gathering dust. Cost you the postage, which will be about $10 from the UK. Blasts comments are the most accurate on here and I concur with what he says about the 1.5, I dont use a Bach anymore but I'm still on a derivative of it, you'll do fine with it if you settle down and keep using it... Doug

Well JSU, that's a very kind offer that I wouldn't pass up. Second chance will have chosen it, so it will be a good one.

Chris Stearn.

[ttf_blast]

Quote from: Thomas Matta on Jan 28, 2008, 01:55AMI still flirt with the 1.5G in my bass.

I haven't had the time to develop the same dependable low range as I enjoy on a Schilke 60 or Griego .5, but the SOUND of the 1.5G is pure bass trombone, heck - just pure trombone is a better way to put it.

I highly suggest some of you nay-sayers to do a side-by-side test using a 1.5G vs. your current boss hog mouthpiece. The focus and core of the sound from the smaller mouthpiece might shock some of you!!

That's just it Thomas.... the sound.... but it's not the easy option.
You have to gain the low register a little differently on a 1 1/2G (I risk preaching to an expert here.. so this is general advice) to the large generation of mouthpieces. I find it better to keep the embouchure a little 'tenorish' then get the lips to relax as much as possible... no big opening-up movements of the face.... Phil Teele talks well about the technique in his book. Even then, it's harder work than the big stuff... but when you get it, you have a fantastic focus and projection that makes it all worth while... plus a super easy high register.

Chris Stearn.

[ttf_JSU BassBone Player]

Hey ya'll, thanks again immensiously for helping me.

Second Chance (Doug), Thank You that is a hugely kind offer and I will take you up on it. I'd be stupid to turn it down or pass it by. I will pm you my address asap. I may have to wait a day to pay shipping. Waiting for some money to hit my account. I will let you know when it is ready. Thanks again guys for all of your help.

[ttf_slidejj]

Quote from: JSU BassBone Player on Jan 27, 2008, 09:34PMI'm currently using a Wick 1AL I traded to a friend. I'm using it until I make a final decision. I really like the Wick, which is why I'm considering the 0AL. I was wondering if anybody could give me some feedback about the 0AL.
The 0AL is about the same rim as a 1AL, just a tad wider according to specs, more so than feel.  The cup is deeper, a 1.5 size rim with a deeper cup, more 1.25 like.  The 0AL has a darker sound than a 1AL and is easier in the low range.  If you decide to buy PM me, I have a gold one in good condition that I no longer play, it worked great in the Yammie I used to own, but not as well for me in the Eddie.

[ttf_EarlNeedham]

Quote from: JSU BassBone Player on Jan 27, 2008, 09:34PMAlso, are the Giardinelli's of today the same quality as the ones you speak of? Was the rim comfortable and was the cup depth somewhat deep, deeper than lets say the faxx? Sorry to ask so many questions, but this mouthpiece is going to be my last one for a very long time. Thanks for all of ya'lls help. 

Unfortunately, since Bob G. retired, the Giardinelli Band Instrument Company has changed the whole "flavor" of their business.  You can no longer get a Giardinelli trombone mouthpiece with a screw rim unless you find one used somewhere, and the only way you could get the semi-flat rim or the wide cushion rim was on the screw-rim.  The won't do those rims on a one-piece.  It's sad -- lotsa guys were using them, back in the day.

Today?  I'd say stick with a Bach, Black, Elliot, even Faxx, and -- well, I hesitate to say it, but sadly, not a current Giardinelli mouthpiece.  Just my opinion, of course.

[ttf_Slidennis]

OK, I like the tone I get from the Bach 1 1/2G I have, but for me, the trigger range with it in the Yamy 620G, or in the Conn 71H is a no go.

Is there anything like a Bach 1 1/2G with a slithtly larger throat and backbore...???

[ttf_second.chance]

A Bach 1.5GM I would suggest. Kindest regards... Doug

[ttf_Slidennis]

Quote from: second.chance on Jan 30, 2008, 12:11AMA Bach 1.5GM I would suggest. Kindest regards... Doug
I heard this one is an air sucker???

[ttf_second.chance]

Well its all relative - true compared to the standard 1.5G it takes more air, but the trade off is that lower register - without the hard work Blast talked about. Its so similar to a 1.5 that you still get most of the characteristics already discussed. It still is basically a 1.5G. Its also relative in the sense that this is still a 'small' mouthpiece compared to the buckets we've been talking about, the air sucking characteristics of a GM cant be anywhere near as bad as some of the big gear can it(?). I come back to the same premise though if you get a good old 1.5G such as described by Chris Stearn, you get that Bass Trombone sound, you have to be patient and you have to work at it but when you do people start to say that you sound like a bass trombone (whatever that means!)... Doug

[ttf_Brisko]

Quote from: Slidennis on Jan 29, 2008, 11:18PMOK, I like the tone I get from the Bach 1 1/2G I have, but for me, the trigger range with it in the Yamy 620G, or in the Conn 71H is a no go.

Is there anything like a Bach 1 1/2G with a slithtly larger throat and backbore...???

Stork 1.5S

All the beauty of a 1.5-sized piece with a bigger backbore.  (The S stands for "symphonic" but I use mine in mostly funk/rock/big band situations).

[ttf_Slidennis]

It is because I hear what that means to sound like a (bass) trombone, that I want to find something else than my Laskey 85MD I'm so happy with on the 71H : I like the 1.5G sound better in high and middle range : it's a trombone sound  (I'm primarily a tenor player, still... for the moment, and like to not sound french horny, nor euphonish, neiter tubish...)

So I guess I'd better try a 1.5 GM soon or later...  

The Yamaha 58 has a larger throat, but its cup shape makes it very unbalanced : a sick bass french horn sound goes out my trombone with it...

[ttf_Slidennis]

Yes, the Stork... I was thinking about that one too, and also heard the "S" throat/backbore was HUGE...

I beleive yours is of the standard (heavy) blank...  How would you compare it to something else you tried in that range, other than being able to move more air and getting an open low register?

[ttf_slidejj]

Quote from: blast on Jan 28, 2008, 04:48AMThat's just it Thomas.... the sound.... but it's not the easy option.
You have to gain the low register a little differently on a 1 1/2G (I risk preaching to an expert here.. so this is general advice) to the large generation of mouthpieces. I find it better to keep the embouchure a little 'tenorish' then get the lips to relax as much as possible... no big opening-up movements of the face.... Phil Teele talks well about the technique in his book. Even then, it's harder work than the big stuff... but when you get it, you have a fantastic focus and projection that makes it all worth while... plus a super easy high register.

Chris Stearn.

I found the Teele method helpful when going back to the 1.5ish piece several months ago.  You do approach it more like playing tenor than on bigger pieces, and to my surprise I found it easier to switch back and forth from bass to tenor.  That's coming in handy now, I'm having to switch between bass and tenor in the same gig again, something I haven't done much in the last year or so, although I use to do it regularly.

[ttf_Brisko]

Quote from: Slidennis on Jan 30, 2008, 06:41AMYes, the Stork... I was thinking about that one too, and also heard the "S" throat/backbore was HUGE...

I beleive yours is of the standard (heavy) blank...  How would you compare it to something else you tried in that range, other than being able to move more air and getting an open low register?

Well, it is the heavy blank.  That's probably the biggest reason I started using the Storks was because I have an older Yamaha 613 (not H) that is pretty light.  The heavy mouthpiece tames the horn down a lot.

I don't have a lot to compare it to, unfortunately.  My bass mouthpiece history is: Schilke 58 for about 4 years, Schilke 59 for  about 10 years (though I didn't play bass for about 3 or 4 years in there), Stork 1.25 for about a year, and now the 1.5S.

In that size range, I've tried a good Bach 1.5G (not Mt Vernon, though), and a Griego, I think it was 1.25 or so.

The 1.5S backbore is pretty open, compared to the standard 1.5 (incidentally the reason I started using the 1.5S was that I was borrowing it from a friend, to try, and he was using his 1.5).  But I would say that the 1.5S feels similar to the Stork 1.25, in terms of backbore (though I've no idea how they actually compare, size-wise).  My impression of the 1.5S, which I've been playing for about 9 months: It has that classic trombone sound that Chris and Tom Matta are talking about.  And for me the high register is unbelievably good, to the point that I can go between bass lines and high unisons comfortably and still sound authentic.  The low register is more work, but worth it.  It forces me to approach the low register in such a way that it has made me a better player; I've had to use a more controlled, small embouchure approach (like what Chris was talking about).  I think the S backbore helps temper the tighter low register a little, as it allows me to use an airstream that I'm used to.

Now whether the heavy blank would work well on other horns, is a different story.  When I started looking for something beyond the Schilke 59, it was specifically to find something to tame down the horn.  In that respect the Storks have been the perfect match.  I chose the 1.25 initially because it was close to what I was used to.  I moved to the 1.5S for reasons that others have elaborated throughout this thread.

[ttf_blast]

If you want a 1 1/2G size that is more free blowing down low, I would go for the Rath 1.5. The change of backbore gives a free blow, but without the air-sucking side to it... and it projects like crazy.

Chris Stearn.

[ttf_slidejj]

Quote from: blast on Jan 30, 2008, 11:39AMIf you want a 1 1/2G size that is more free blowing down low, I would go for the Rath 1.5. The change of backbore gives a free blow, but without the air-sucking side to it... and it projects like crazy.

Chris Stearn.

Both the traditional rim and wide rim models are very free-blowing with tremendous projection.  Until I played one I didn't think a mouthpiece with such a small throat could be so open in the double valve range.

[ttf_Slidennis]

Quote from: slidejj on Jan 30, 2008, 12:10PMBoth the traditional rim and wide rim models are very free-blowing with tremendous projection.  Until I played one I didn't think a mouthpiece with such a small throat could be so open in the double valve range.
I can believe it...  The backbore and throat shape are really critical for the blow and projection, much more the shape than the size...

Thanks you both... 

Now, how I put an hand on Rath mpc here on the (European) continent?

[ttf_anonymous]

Gabe

I play a 1 1/2G and am not of right mind.

Thanks!

[ttf_mellotbone]

QuoteIf you want a 1 1/2G size that is more free blowing down low, I would go for the Rath 1.5. The change of backbore gives a free blow, but without the air-sucking side to it... and it projects like crazy.

Works for me. I was having a bad time from low C on down. The Rath 1.5 W has been a big help. It's very unique, as the tone is darker than the Bach 1.5 but it projects beautifully. And you can fire it up if you need to. We do a couple of "novelty" numbers like Puttin on the Ritz and Sweet Georgia Brown, and I can get all the bark I need from it.

[ttf_Slidennis]

Quote from: mellotbone on Feb 16, 2008, 07:48AMWorks for me. I was having a bad time from low C on down. The Rath 1.5 W has been a big help. It's very unique, as the tone is darker than the Bach 1.5 but it projects beautifully. And you can fire it up if you need to. We do a couple of "novelty" numbers like Puttin on the Ritz and Sweet Georgia Brown, and I can get all the bark I need from it.
Came in the day before yesterday.  Many thanks to Chris Beaumont for its quick an good service!

First impression : I was a bit afraid the first moment I tried it because it is so less resonant than the Bach 1.5G and the Laskey 85M, with less bright overtones in it...

It's a more massive mpc, more bowlish...

But the more I tried and used it, the more I liked : it gives just the bass bone tone I have in my mind, even if it takes some effort...  And the projection is there, but I'm simply more acustomed to a bright tone.

I tried it at my brass band rehearsal yesterday, and the conductor was very positively impressed (he's pro tuba player)
And yes, it projects, even in that quite dead room...

It has a lot of core in the sound, and the tone is really well anchored if that make sense.
I did not think I could have that kind of rather dark tone out of the Conn 71H...

Now, the high register is much harder to get and make it sing, but I suppose I just have to work at it, after all I'm rather new to bass (not even 1 year...)

So, the Rath 1.5 is not a shortcut to anything, but a great pro piece of gear IMO...

[ttf_anonymous]

Quote from: Slidennis on Feb 21, 2008, 01:46AMCame in the day before yesterday.  Many thanks to Chris Beaumont for its quick an good service!

First impression : I was a bit afraid the first moment I tried it because it is so less resonant than the Bach 1.5G and the Laskey 85M, with less bright overtones in it...

It's a more massive mpc, more bowlish...

But the more I tried and used it, the more I liked : it gives just the bass bone tone I have in my mind, even if it takes some effort...  And the projection is there, but I'm simply more acustomed to a bright tone.

I tried it at my brass band rehearsal yesterday, and the conductor was very positively impressed (he's pro tuba player)
And yes, it projects, even in that quite dead room...

It has a lot of core in the sound, and the tone is really well anchored if that make sense.
I did not think I could have that kind of rather dark tone out of the Conn 71H...

Now, the high register is much harder to get and make it sing, but I suppose I just have to work at it, after all I'm rather new to bass (not even 1 year...)

So, the Rath 1.5 is not a shortcut to anything, but a great pro piece of gear IMO...

I have a Rath 2 on which I opened up the inner diameter.  It's a very comfortable mouthpiece with an effortlessly pure tone.  But, the bowl shape seems to be an issue for me regarding articulation.  Nevertheless, it's a great piece.  As a tenor player, I can't deal with the compromise at this stage of my development.  Perhaps, one day I'll pick it up and LOVE it the same way that I LOVE my R4 horn.

DG

[ttf_anonymous]

i like the 1.5GM
the rim is small enough to double on easily- it feels like a tenor mouthpiece more than a yeo size. it also allows me to play in the high register without being "woofy" because it has a small cup compared to my yeo (up to C or Db) and the tuning is good.
but the bore is big so you can play low stuff if needed (and loud-ish too)
it doesnt take your air if you use an efficient embouchure, one that isnt too open. i use my regular tenor embouchure with it.
a yeo is fun to blast out low c's but it has no high range for me and it forces me to close my embouchure more than id like
i was switching between those alot until i realized that my school's bass was just bad.
and if you need to play in a small group in a small room you can switch to the 1.5 G which feels exactly the same but is quieter.
um...what else?
i cant wait for a stainless steel copy to come out.
-justin

-conn 88ht-GW kadja/euros
-bach 50BG-1/2GM