Manipulating tone colour

[eatanick]

Hi all,

What are your thoughts on changing tone colour without changing equipment? I realise different formants can be created by changing the shape of the oral cavity or tongue position, but retaining depth of sound while generating some brightness eludes me - except at extreme volumes!

So, how might you approach creating a brighter sound without just playing louder?

Cheers!

[ddickerson]

I think that the more centered your buzz is, the more bright your tone can be. Buzz Pitch == Slide Position. IOW, perfect resonance.

[baileyman]

Seems it is possible to be perfectly centered and also have a dull sound. Or a bright one. The difference seems to be in the oral cavity, which can be tuned to the note intended. When in tune the overtones can really shout.

There are some pretty extreme tone examples, like the "birdphone" sound on Spike Jone's records (who was the player?). Kai Winding routinely used such a sound. Sam Burtis can nearly isolate individual overtones and make them quite prominent, I think by manipulating throat volumes and shape in addition to mouth volumes. I once heard Ian Bousfield play a piece originally for French horn on his Courtois .547, and man, he sure made the thing sound like a horn. He did not however discuss that manipulation.

[ddickerson]

Seems it is possible to be perfectly centered and also have a dull sound. Or a bright one. The difference seems to be in the oral cavity, which can be tuned to the note intended. When in tune the overtones can really shout.

There are some pretty extreme tone examples, like the "birdphone" sound on Spike Jone's records (who was the player?). Kai Winding routinely used such a sound. Sam Burtis can nearly isolate individual overtones and make them quite prominent, I think by manipulating throat volumes and shape in addition to mouth volumes. I once heard Ian Bousfield play a piece originally for French horn on his Courtois .547, and man, he sure made the thing sound like a horn. He did not however discuss that manipulation.

Yes, you can get different sounds by playing with your oral cavity, but I don't think that would be the preferred way to get a good bright sound. The more conventional way is to achieve good resonance. if you feel you're playing with good resonance, and still getting a duller tone than you want, you might then experiment with what you're doing with your oral cavity.

MyBad, perfect resonance includes buzzing the right pitch, slide position, and oral cavity by using the different vowel sounds(tongue position), as you do shrink the oral cavity as you play higher notes, and vice versa.

[Doug Elliott]

It is largely the oral cavity, but there's much more to it, that's the stuff that I do in private lessons because of individual differences... everything depends on what you're already doing and where you need to go from there.

[Doubler]

You can change the oral cavity and/or the way you use your lips, but these are minor adjustments. The most important things in this process are you ears. It doesn't hurt to record yourself to verify the results.

[Savio]

Hi all,

What are your thoughts on changing tone colour without changing equipment? I realise different formants can be created by changing the shape of the oral cavity or tongue position, but retaining depth of sound while generating some brightness eludes me - except at extreme volumes!

So, how might you approach creating a brighter sound without just playing louder?

Cheers!

It seems to me you have a kind of "sound goal" and I think thats the first step on the way.
My own experience to manipulate our own sound and make interesting colours is to first have a sound goal. Then practice, try different things over some time. Nothing comes over night. Then, in my experience, dont choose to big equipment. Everyone is different but too big make it more difficult to colour the sound and style. Of course, too small also make it more difficult. Doug Elliott have experience with this. One thing is sure, you have to work at it. I try to make my sound bright at low volumes and darker at loud volumes.
A good teacher to guide is a big help. Its often told but its a big help.

Leif

[norbie2018]

Listening to Ron Barron performing French trombone pieces. There are times when he gets loud he is very bright, sometimes even strident. There are other times he plays loudly and it's sweet - all musically dependant.

Red brass bells have the reputation of training dark until higher volumes where they brighten up.
Alot of what is perceived as brightness is equipment dependant.

[timothy42b]

There is probably an interaction between playing slightly above or below pitch center, and changing your oral cavity which also has some effect on pitch. I would guess for most of us the pitch center effect dominates.

[bcschipper]

When I took singing lessons, we used a warm up exercise that consisted of singing "nghaaaeeeiiiooouuu" (German pronunciation) in order to figure out our resonances in the head. Essentially you play around with your oral cavity. I adapted this exercise to the trombone by changing it to "taaa taee tiii tooo tuuu" (German pronunciation) on each note of a b flat major scale starting mid range going up. In the mid range closed vowels like in "tiii" just dull the sound but in the upper range it brightens the sound.

Another thing is aperture of your lips. A loose aperture makes it more brassy. For a nice warm dark tone I use a wide oral cavity like in "tooo" (German "o", not like in English "me too") but a rather small aperture.

Anyway, I am not a professional.

[baileyman]

Yes, I find vowel formations in my mouth to make the sound I want, but then trying to speak some of them off the horn they sound nothing like any vowel I know of!

[bcschipper]

Through the instrument they don't have to sound like the vowel you know. The point is that thinking different vowels changes the oral cavity. It widens and closes different parts even lower in your throat. I believe this effects the sound color (and also the ease of playing in different tessituras).

[timothy42b]

Yes, I find vowel formations in my mouth to make the sound I want, but then trying to speak some of them off the horn they sound nothing like any vowel I know of!

We tend to think there are only 5 vowels like we were taught in elementary school, but there is a continuum of infinite variations between each one.

Last night I was at a concert with Anda Union, a Mongolian throat singing group. Those singers really know how to manipulate oral cavity resonances. Wow!