suggestions on new horn

[Kessinger]

Hi I'm a high school student looking for advice on a new horn. I was told by a professional that I should invest in a large bore of either Bach 42b, Conn 88H or yamaha 8820 Xeno.
Currently I am only playing for my school and I am not sure if I should invest 2k in a second hand horn just for school and possibly never touch it again once I graduate and go to uni. Would like some advice on possible ways on if its possible to keep playing fter high school whether in a community band or in a uni band (not taking music)
Second of all, I would also like some suggestions on which model would be better(price and tone wise) if i never get a chance to try all three. My playing is naturally pretty loud and bright and stands out quite a lot apparently. additional question : open or closed wrap for the models listed.

some suggestions would really help and sorry for the broken english

[NotSkilledHere]

you can definitely play after high school! you can find lots of used bach 42's around the 1k-1.1k mark, 88h's for like 1.2-1.3k. and xenos for 1.6k roughly. as long as you take care of them, you could sell it later and not lose much if any money.

We can't say which is better because it would come down to the specific example and obviously what you prefer when you play it. if you are on the bright side normally, I would suggest a gold bell 42 or 882.

[BGuttman]

First: Bach 42B, Conn 88H, and Yamaha Xeno are all excellent pro quality instruments. Probably way more than you now (or maybe ever) need. I don't know what level your High School plays at; or whether the Director listens with his eyes as well as his ears or not.

A large bore instrument has certain playing tendencies that may not be optimal should you wind up playing in amateur ensembles in the future Often a medium bore (13.2 mm) instrument will work better if you suddenly don't have a lot of time to practice. Also, a medium bore instrument will help your upper register at the expense of the lower register.

In your circumstance I would certainly look into used instruments. You should be able to find something in the US$1000-1500. Some suggested brands in the American market:

Bach 36B or 42B.
Benge 175F or 190F
Conn 79H or 88H (or an 88H with an SL2525 slide)
Holton TR-150, TR-158, TR-159
King 215F (3B+F), 2104F (4BF) or 2105 (5B)
Olds Opera
Reynolds Contempora
Yamaha Medium: 646, 684, 640; Large: 648, 682, 620. These instruments all look alike and look like some Xeno models.

After school there are community bands, community orchestras, community jazz bands, and Brass Bands, almost all of which take amateur musicians. Some may require auditions; some may charge membership fees, some do both, and some do neither.

As far as the bright tone, I found that gold or red brass bells tend to calm this trend; but some other design choices will hide this effect. I played a Yamaha 682G in orchestra and a Bach 36CG (C is convertible) in concert band.

[Doug Elliott]

.525 bore will be the most useful to you, and keep the 354. I used a 354 and 36B for many years to cover anything I needed to play. They're both small shank so you can get away with using the same mouthpiece on both, although it's not ideal. You can probably find a used horn that size for a very reasonable price.

[dwcarder]

The advice I got from the band director in middle school was to make sure you play in the university band through your first year, or you will likely never play again. Those were harsh words to a kid, but I think he was entirely right. Because of all the new opportunities and such you find yourself in at university, it would have been too easy to put the trombone down and not look back.

At my university, even as a non-major I was still able to rent a horn from the school for as long I was playing. It might even have been free or nominal cost. You might want to see if there is an option like that for you.

Now well past those days, my .547 only sees use at the university sponsored wind band each summer. I have to gear up well ahead of time to make use of it as Bruce points out. For other groups it is simply too dark and too big to fit in. I don't have a .525, but I bring the .500 to all the "fun" stuff. I think Doug makes a key point on practicality.

[GACMoose]

I'm not going to attempt to answer the which horn question, but as far as a non-major playing in college and beyond: I was a music minor but that was because I covered most of the course requirements in lessons and performance classes (bands, etc.) I'm a good player but certainly not of the capability of most of the folks on this list. But, I love to play so auditioned and joined every group that included a trombone (concert band, stage band, bone choir, brass choir, orchestra, Chapel brass, etc.) I also played in non-class groups (a brass trio three of us made up, etc.) What an experience! An added benefit was that some of these groups took me to Europe twice, part of Canada and throughout the US. You may wonder how to find the time. If you want to, you will. I had quit organized athletics by college and didn't join a fraternity. Those both helped. Even with all this time on music, I still found time to drive school bus, date and have an active social life, attend other campus events like plays, music, dance, games, etc. All of this while majoring in physics and minoring in mathematics. Yes, it can be done - just choose your priorities and then make the time.

Now, many decades later, I'm still playing. I play in a non-profit symphony orchestra, an 18-pc big band, and a freelance gig every so often if I get lucky. It can certainly be a life-long enjoyment if you so choose. If you make the effort, you won't regret it!

[Kessinger]

Honestly thats very reassuring, thanks for the reply. Ideally I would still very much like to play somewhere after I realized how much I like playing the trombone this past year so this helps a lot!

[boneAngo]

To be honest I will recommend you to try them all. In my opinion, if you are playing ensembles instead of solos, I will recommend open wrap (the valve really depends). 88H not recommended as it is better in playing solo. Bach 42 also not recommend as the resistance is a bit high. Go for 8820.

[Posaunus]

To be honest I will recommend you to try them all. In my opinion, if you are playing ensembles instead of solos, I will recommend open wrap (the valve really depends). 88H not recommended as it is better in playing solo. Bach 42 also not recommend as the resistance is a bit high. Go for 8820.

Are these recommendations based on your extensive experience performing with a variety of ensembles over several years, or ... are you passing on "folklore" you have encountered in your long career as a trombonist?
Have you played excellent examples of a Conn 88H, a Bach 42, or a Yamaha 8820? For how long? What vintage of each?
Just wanting to ensure this is expert advice.

[boneAngo]

To be honest I will recommend you to try them all. In my opinion, if you are playing ensembles instead of solos, I will recommend open wrap (the valve really depends). 88H not recommended as it is better in playing solo. Bach 42 also not recommend as the resistance is a bit high. Go for 8820.

Are these recommendations based on your extensive experience performing with a variety of ensembles over several years, or ... are you passing on "folklore" you have encountered in your long career as a trombonist?
Have you played excellent examples of a Conn 88H, a Bach 42, or a Yamaha 8820? For how long? What vintage of each?
Just wanting to ensure this is expert advice.

To be honest my friends are using these trombones and I seldomly try them. Just wanna emphasize to try all of them and choose the right one for yourself. Those are the comments I give after I try the instruments for a while, but not playing them for years. I know that everyone is unique, that's why I am sharing my opinions only, for your reference only.

[Matt K]

The wrap makes absolutely zero difference, relative to how well it is assembled, unless it is designed poorly (e.g., the open wrap of the Bach 36BO and 42BO, which prominently feature a Bach 50BO return tube for.... reasons).

[Digidog]

I would not buy a horn based on what wrap it has; a good horn is a good horn.

The horn you choose to buy has to fit your playing and the circumstances you are to play it in; it can be hard to play a nice, trimmed and defined big band lead with a Conn 88 or a Bach 42, and equally hard to fill up the timbre of a Mahler symphony on a King 3B.

As for chamber music or small ensembles, any horn that makes you play your best and manages the demands from the charts and the dynamics and timbres of the ensembles, is possible to use. I have played all sizes of trombones in quartets, octets, trombone ensembles, chamber wind quintet, wind tentet and whatnot of ensembles; from a Yamaha 697 through my Shires 0.500 Custom via a King 3B and a 3B+ to a Conn 88 and a Yamaha 881.

The answer to what horn anyone should buy, is therefore the horn which plays best that also covers what would mostly be played on it while it also is an acceptable compromise in other circumstances.

Based on that I'd recommend to try Conn 88s, Yamaha medium or large bores, Bach 42s, Getzen medium or large bores, Jupiter, XO and Stomvi dittos, and in that spectrum you should be able to find a horn that suits you, plays well, is of good quality and wouldn't cost too much.

Good luck and best wishes!