Moving up from a 6 1/2 AL

[jaydencday]

I've never really considered upgrading my mouthpiece before now. My trombone is a Jupiter JTB1150F, and I've been using the mouthpiece it came with, a Jupiter 6 1/2 AL. My section leader today told me that he recommends I get a new mouthpiece that gives me a more full and brassy sound. I would also like something that might help playing in a higher range easier, as my all state etudes have notes up to a Bb in the ledger lines. What would be the best mouthpiece that fits the criteria I need?

[BGuttman]

Are you taking any lessons?

Everything you are describing will respond better to intelligent practice with good guidance.

I could suggest a smaller mouthpiece to help with the range, but it will probably hurt your sound. I could suggest a larger mouthpiece for a fuller sound, but it won't be "brassy" (and it will make the higher notes more difficult).

Before I suggest a mouthpiece, I would suggest a lesson with a good teacher.

There have been a lot of very successful professional trombonists who played a 6 1/2 AL sized mouthpiece.

[Vegasbound]

What does your teacher say? As Bruce suggested if you do not have a trombone teacher get one, I doubt your “section leader” is an experienced pro/ teacher and nothing you mentioned cannot be achieved by consistent well ordered methodical practice.

No one can/should advise you without more info on your playing and seeing/hearing you, if you do not have a trombone teacher a lesson with Doug Elliott would be more beneficial and costs the same\less than a mouthpiece.

It may be that the 61/2 is the ideal size for you and you just need to practice, or you may be advised by Doug that a larger rim will suit your embouchure but you will be armed with the info you need to make the most improvement.

All that said if you already have a teacher he/she is best placed and should be the one you turn to first!

[brassmedic]

Nope. 6 1/2 AL is optimal for high range on a .547 bore trombone. Any smaller and you're going to have a mismatch. You just have to practice the high range. Most people play a larger size than that, but that will definitely NOT make high range easier.

[Doug Elliott]

For a lot of people, a larger rim size than that actually
DOES make high range easier.

[robseaman]

I found I could control my air better with a 5G versus 6 1/2 AL. The problem is slotting the high E and F. Hard to get a decent tone when the slide is moving.

[GGJazz]

Hello all .
Hello Jaydencday .


As you wrote , you are playing with a Jupiter 6 1/2 AL mpc ... I think that , apart changing the mpc' s size ( 6 1/2 AL , 5G , ecc) , it would be better moving to a real serious brand ; at least like Schilke , Laskey , Warburton , Marcinkiewicz , Bach , Denis Wick , ecc . You may find that the 6 1/2 AL size is right for you !

Regards
Giancarlo

[imsevimse]

If the Jupiter 6 1/2 AL is a good copy of a Bach 6 1/2 AL then you have a good mouthpiece already. Don't change a mouthpiece because some other guy tells you to change. A mouthpiece change should be done if you find a mouthpiece that works better for you. Ask to try your friends mouthpiece and see if it works better for you and then decide. I have hundreds of mouthpieces and my emboushure work on all of them. For me it hasn't to do with if high notes are possible or not, for me it is to find the right mouthpiece to fit the context.
Lead trombone in big band? Bach MT Vernon 12C, Bach 11C, Bach 6 3/4C, Nils Landgren, but can work with a 6 1/2 AL too but that is a little more work than I want. I have more stamina in the high register with smaller mouthpieces but I can play as high on the larger ones.
Classical playing on small/medium bore? Yamaha Nils Landgren, Bach 6 1/2 AL, Hammond 12M or 12XML.
Large bore? Bach 6 1/2 AL, Hammond 12M, 12MXL, 11M, 11ML, 11L.

A teacher and lots of right practice is probably the best way to improve your high register, it is better spent money, better spent than money on a new mouthpiece.

/Tom

[OneTon]

Woodwind Brasswind has Faxx 6.5 AL large shank mouthpieces in stock for $34.99. They are very good, faithful copies of the original Mount Vernon Bach mouthpiece proof set that were given to a worker there when Bach moved out of Mount Vernon. They don’t come in “all” sizes because the set was incomplete. They are cheaper than Bach and just as good or better.

Doug Elliott offers fitting services that have helped a lot of people.

[harrisonreed]

The only thing that will really help you optimize your range and equipment is to find out what rim size works best with your face, which can be done with a teacher, practice, and trial and error. It's tough though, because you don't know what you don't know. You can't assess a mouthpiece and how it impacts your sound and playing if you don't have a baseline level of proficiency and, more importantly, consistency in that proficiency and in your (good) fundamentals, so that you're not picking up the trombone every day and thinking, "I have no idea what it's going to happen today". You can't assess anything if you're at that stage.

Easier said than done. That's 95% of brass playing.

The 6.5AL is probably fine. You probably don't need to get a different mouthpiece unless it is physically painful to play it. Just learn to play it really well, and work on expanding your range away from middle F, in both directions, without moving too far from your natural embouchure setting for middle F. If you are having to shift a lot to play above the staff or before the staff, it could be that you need a different (likely larger) rim diameter, but it's just as likely that it is a flaw in your playing mechanics. Probably not what you wanted, but I truly don't think you can gauge or assess what you need in a mouthpiece without knowing your own playing, having very steady consistency in your approach every day, and then doing a lot of trial and error, which can be expensive. Suggestions on the forum will be just guesses.

Now once you know what rim works best for your face, and you've got a grip on everything above, the world is your oyster. You can use the same rim on everything, and tailor everything about the mouthpiece to the kind of playing you want to do. That's maybe the last 1% of brass playing, if you're really good. If you're like me, you can only get .0005% of that last 1% out of the mouthpiece.

[Kbiggs]

First, do you trust your section leader? Is he an honest and caring critic of your playing? What does he mean by “full” and “brassy”? What kind of music do you play with him? Is that the kind of music you play most often? What do you like about your playing? What don’t you like? What do you want to achieve from a change in mpc that your current set up doesn’t give you? Do you think your sound gets “full” and “brassy” when needed? If so, then maybe a change in mpc is in order.

As a couple of people already said, a lot of players use a 6.5 or 6.5 AL and do very well.

What might be more helpful is a good, caring, and qualified teacher who knows about mpcs and embouchure and can recommend something for you. If they recommend a 6.5 xx after hearing you play, give it a shot.

And, there’s something to be said for careful, mindful practice.

[Bach5G]

You might consider this: as stated above, Faxx mpcs are decent copies of MV Bachs. Buy a Faxx 6 1/2AL, a 5G, and a 4G. Try them for a few months and see which one you like the most.

Although, frankly, I think your section leader probably doesn’t know what he’s talking about and you’d be better off taking advice from a competent trombone teacher who has heard you play.